DS1 Design Changes

Topics primarily or specifically about the DS1. Many topics are of general interest, so please use forum sections on Rigging, Sails, etc. where appropriate.

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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby tomodda » Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:28 pm

Cliff:

I'd guess that your #295 is from late in 1957/early '58. As far as I can figure out, until the mid-60's, O'Day had one mold and they popped one hull a day off it. So, between the sail number and your design details, that's the basis for my guess.

Fair winds!

Tom
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby Cliff » Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:16 pm

TY Tom

Still curious about putting "DS Used" in the Class space.
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby GreenLake » Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:25 am

Cliff wrote: It's Hull #2018; Sail #295 Still have the builder's plate on the transom coaming. The class # is hand scratched in as:"DS used" Also the waterline is molded into the hull. Idea of year?

Class and sail # are normally the same for the DS. Perhaps these were different in earlier years?

Nowadays, with HINs, the sail/class # is even part of the hull number. Things change.

The molded deck with the fake planks makes it an early model.

August 1963 they reached the 1,500th DS. Based on tom's calculation of a hull a day, at full capacity, assuming they averaged 300, it would take about 4 years to do 1200. At that point you are at August '59. Let things ramp up a bit more slowly, and tom's guess of '57/'58 is beginning to look good.

Meaning of "DS used"? An annotation that the sail number was based on the DS? Who knows - and who knows who did the scratching.
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby tomodda » Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:17 am

I should have written - no more than one hull per day, 300ish/year. I can imagine bad moldings, slow drying, slow sales, or just other work to do all slowing down production.

What I curious about is Cliff's molded-in waterline, I've never seen this on any boat (sailing anyway, stinkpots don't count.) Normally I try to keep the hull smooth - I'd be cursing the ghost of whoever molded a gouge into my hull in 1957/8! I suppose along the waterline it doesn't really affect boat speed, but still....
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby Cliff » Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:38 pm

Tom

The waterline is a slight indent into the hull which functions as a paint guide line. This is not common?

I'm embarrassed to show it but attached is a pic of the boat--The black scar is an epoxy repair from a cracked by ice when the boat was left without a cover in Alexandria NH--I hope I'm not as ignorant as I was then

4-18 Stern - Copy.JPG
4-18 Stern - Copy.JPG (183.65 KiB) Viewed 3656 times
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby GreenLake » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:19 pm

Cliff wrote:The waterline is a slight indent into the hull which functions as a paint guide line. This is not common?

This waterline is also much wider at the rear than matches my recollection from last painting my boat . .

Looks like the re-thought the process a bit.
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby Cliff » Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:10 pm

GL

It seems logical that a say 2" waterline width on an almost vertical surface at the bow would translate to a wider width for the same waterline width at the stern where the overhang flattens out.

Cliff
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby tomodda » Thu Oct 11, 2018 2:20 pm

GL:

What Cliff said (wrote), most boat waterlines/boot stripes are painted in to look like it's an even width seen from the side, so they broaden out if the deadrise changes angle. Which is why I HATE painting waterlines....

Cliff:

Well, I'll be d*mned! I checked the waterline on my new-to-me DS1. What I thought was a lousy job with "boot stripe tape" is actually an etched-in waterline and a lousy paint job! Now I can be mad at both the Original Owner and Marscott Plastics. My cup of angst runneth over :D

Anyway, so even more evidence that you have a 1957/58 boat, since your details match mine. Do you have a wooden bulkhead between the cuddy interior and the bow foam? Check my photos in post titled #37. And I'll worry about hull paint, boot stripes, waterline gouges over the winter. Gonna enjoy fall sailing season first!

Fair winds,

Tom
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby Cliff » Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:10 pm

Tom

Can not get under the boat now to see what's in the bow for flotation. There was no flotation along or under the seats. The stern has an air tank. When we bought it 2nd hand it had a square hole rough cut into the tank so the previous owners could have some additional storage space. There was no attempt to put any kind of waterproof door on the opening! I FGs up this breach and installed a waterproof round hatch. Not sure if O'Day had an access to this air tank originally. I do know my old Grumman canoe had air tanks with a round hatch in both ends before they started using foam.

I have purposely swamped the boat on a nice summer day on the lake. Once you got it upright the gunnels were above the waterline and it did not take long to bail it out. Don't know if this would be the case in the ocean on a rough day.

Hope to raise it off the pine needles soon in prep of painting the hull--then I'll check on what is going on with the bow flotation. Forgot maybe flotation in an air chamber in back of seats. Will see.

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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby GreenLake » Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:42 pm

Cliff wrote:It seems logical that a say 2" waterline width on an almost vertical surface at the bow would translate to a wider width for the same waterline width at the stern where the overhang flattens out.


In my recollections, mine don't show the same extreme widening, but memory is a tricky thing.
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby Aerosill » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:31 pm

GreenLake wrote:
Cliff wrote:It seems logical that a say 2" waterline width on an almost vertical surface at the bow would translate to a wider width for the same waterline width at the stern where the overhang flattens out.


In my recollections, mine don't show the same extreme widening, but memory is a tricky thing.


Looked at my boat today (will create a thread about it once I resize the pictures so they can be attached, but registered as a 1961, the sail number might be 598, molded planks on the bow, other things that tell me 1961 and 598 might be correct), and measured the waterline. At the bow, it measures 1 3/4" high. At the stern it is 12" in width, but appears to be 1 3/4" in height when viewed from the side.

Jim
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby tomodda » Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:26 am

Cliff wrote:Tom

I have purposely swamped the boat on a nice summer day on the lake. Once you got it upright the gunnels were above the waterline and it did not take long to bail it out. Don't know if this would be the case in the ocean on a rough day.

Cliff


Brave man! But good to know, thank you. What flotation (if any) do you have in the aft space, under the transom "deck"? Mine just had a lot of loose foam blocks and a ridiculously inadequate thin plywood cover on a huge hole in the aft bulkhead. Well, 1 foot by 2 foot hole. Not watertight at all, I cleared everything out and am pondering what to do.

Tom
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby Cliff » Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:38 pm

Hello Tom

Nice warm day—easy to swamp w/CB up. When I first got the boat the rear transom deck area had a ragged hole in it so it was certainly not waterproof. I can not believe the PO knew what they were doing by cutting a hole in the transom bulkhead. I patched this up so that there is an effective air tank around the stern and both sides up to the thwarts. I saw that there appears to be a hole in your transom also—is there a waterproof hatch cover?

I do not know what I have for flotation in the bow—can not remember any wood bulkhead holding in Styrofoam. There was no Styrofoam on the boat in the air tanks and I want no part of Styrofoam from the waterlogged discussions I’ve seen on this forum. The construction of the air tanks looks pretty substantial and no water leaked into the tanks while I had the boat swamped. I have an access port on the rear bulkhead so I can check if there was water.

I plan to raise the boat off the pine needles soon so I can crawl under and check out the forward section.

Will send some pictures of the inside, if the critters that are living under do not get me.
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby tomodda » Sun Oct 14, 2018 5:27 pm

Cliff: Don't go crawling around under boat on my account! Send some pics of her sailing in the spring (on a separate thread, we're getting WAY off-topic here).
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Re: DS1 Design Changes

Postby Cliff » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:52 pm

Tom

Isn't the topic Design Changes? Type of flotation is a design condition that interests me--why or when O"Day went to foam--

Did you refill your boat with foam? Does your transom bulkhead remain open?
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