what's she worth?

[CaptainB360]

Hello. New to the forum. Looking for input on the value of my 1982 DS1. She's completely restored and has custom touches such as pop-up cleats and a painted mast among other things. The entire process took three years and she's never seen the water since. However I just don't seem to have the time to take her out (and relearn how to sail). Let me know what you think. Thanks!

[Roger]

which it appears to be, you should be able to fetch between 3000 to 3500 depending on the conditon of the sails, motor, trailer etc. Average boat is 2500, but the price you get depends on many factors, time of year, and demand for the boat in your area, plus the other things I mentioned, sails, motor, trailer. Other things that factor into the price are whether it has been only fresh water sailed or salt. Same for the trailer. Good luck with your sale.

[algonquin]

Looks like you are from Maine.

Sharp looking DS. Nicely restored and nicely equipped. If the sails are in similar condition to the boat I wouldn’t hesitate to list her for at least $3000. There have been inquiries on this site for a DS in the Maine region. Try listing it in the Uncle Henry’s. It would get considerable exposer over the New England area. Brad

[GreenLake]

Looking at the pictures I notice that there are molded indentations on the seats and supports on the CB trunk for a pair of thwarts, which would provide lateral support to the CB trunk. The thwarts themselves aren't there, so it appears you are missing a small, but crucial piece of transverse strength.

Curious: Are these just missing in the photos? Were they missing when you got the boat?

The boat looks less cluttered without them, but I understand their purpose is twofold. One is to help the CB trunk resist sideways twisting when there's a strong sideways load on the CB. The other is to help stiffen the boat a bit, by "tying" the sides together in the middle, so they can't flex outward as much. And many other useful purposes not provided for in the design (see the threadby ctenidae)

[CaptainB360]

The thwarts aren't in right now, but I do have them. Thanks for the concern.

The sails are the only thing that are not new/restored when it comes to the boat. They are original and have seen better days. Would it be worth my time/money to have them replaced in order to increase resale value?

And I'm from Michigan and has lived it's entire life in fresh water.

The boat doesn't have a motor, not even a mount for it. I wanted to keep her as original as possible and to me, a sailboat this size just doesn't need one.

Appreciate all the replies. I've got many extras that will be included with the boat such as dry bags, wind vane, top-of-the-line life vests, paddles, etc. The pictures really don't do the boat justice.

[Peterw11]

You've done a beautiful job with the restoration, and I'd guess the value would definitely be on the high end of the DS1 price scale. Check Craigslist, and other used boat sites in your area to see what a good boat is selling for.

Unfortunately, the sails are a major component in the overall value. Replacement of the main and jib can run from $500+ (Intensity Sails, Chinese made, but definitely a good product) to close to a grand for the better known domestic items.

You're also missing an outboard, which many boats on the market will have. My '68 DS1 came with an old ('1982) Johnson 4hp, which proved to be troublesome. I found a functioning, but well used, '78 Evinrude 4hp on Craiglist for $300, which is what they all seem to be selling for. Even an old one is worth quite a bit of dough.

I wouldn't spend the money on the motor, or the sails. Negotiate and deduct it from the final selling price if it proves to be an issue. It may not be.

What products did you use in the resto? Specifically, what kind of finishes on the brightwork and cockpit? How were they applied?

They look great, and it'd be a shame to actually put the thing in the water and mess them up again (kidding). BTW, do you have the floorboards, as well?

The pop-up cleats are also intriguing. Where did you source those?

In closing, I'd suggest you list it on Craigslist and any other similar site in your area, price it on the high end (because of condition) and see how it goes.

Be sure to post pictures, as that's what works best in any ad, and your boat, in particular, should be seen.

I doubt you'll have trouble moving it.

[GreenLake]

Good to know that you have the thwarts.

I agree with others, that trying to get sails for this will not likely lead to a better financial result for you. If your sails were really moth-eaten and truly dingy-looking, you might be better off leaving them off altogether. Otherwise a good cleaning or new bags might be all that's needed to prevent them from impacting an overall positive appearance.

The upside for a new owner is that they get to choose their own. Perhaps, an inexperienced new owner might appreciate your offer of guidance in selecting a set of sails.

The business with the motor, I wouldn't stress for the same reason. I bought mine without, for example.

Good luck!

[Roger]

I had previously indicated that a boat motor and trailer in top condition would likely sell for 3500 depending time of year and where you live.

Based on that and the information you provide, I would deduct 1000 for a new motor and 600 for a new set of sails. Those would definately be negotiating points for a prospective buyer.

[ctenidae]

And many other useful purposes not provided for in the design (see the threadby ctenidae)

Nice looking boat. Didn't realize the '82's didn't have hanging shelves or a forward bulkhead to the storage area. Very nice job, though. I'm jealous of your mast stand on the trailer, too.

[Peterw11]

Roger:

Are you suggesting he lop a grand off the selling price because he doesn't provide a new motor with the boat?

If so, I think I have to disagree.

A decent 2 or 3 hp kicker can be had for much less than that, even new ones. I've seen Suzukis selling on line for $650 or so. Mercs, for slightly more.

And who expects a new motor with an old boat? Most of the used DS's I've seen ( and I've looked at dozens) have motors in the 5-10 year old range, if not older (mine was 25 years old).

I figure a fairer deduction would be closer to 400 bucks, as that's what a decent used kicker seems to be worth.

I think the same differential would apply to sails. New ones are rare on a used boat. He has sails, they're just not great shape. I'd knock another 400 off for sail replacement.

His boat is in excellent condition, other than those items, much better than you average used DS. It's worth a bit more to a buyer because of that, IMO.

[Roger]

From his previous post, I see there is no motor on the boat. A new motor of that size here in Canada runs at about a grand, so that was my reference point. Obviously a used motor would be much less. Similar with sails. If the sails are at all functional, a prospective buyer may be able to live with the sails on the boat. My point however was that if a boat, (not necessarily this boat) was valued at whatever, with no sails and no motor, as a buyer, I would negotiate a price starting at a grand less for no motor, and 600 less with no sails, and the price of a trailer less if no trailer. As yes, (start slinging arrows now) if a boat was only a hull and rigging, but in excellent shape, then perhaps it should go for significantly less than a similar shaped boat with newer sails, good trailer, and newer motor.

No, I am not suggesting that a 3500 boat without a trailer -500, without sails -600, and without a motor -1000 be sold for 1400 but that might be where negotiations start from the buyers perspective.

There might be mitigating factors that increase the price, as I indicated in my first post, and this boat is a fine examble given its excellent condition. But for example, if you are having a fire sale in late November, then you might expect a lower selling price than if you are sailing during spring fever. He is selling at the right time to maximize his asking price.

Similarly, the selling price will be affected by how many other similar boats are nearby and their asking prices.

Its all about supply and demand, and although we are dearly and emotionally attached to our boats and generally value them much higher that their actual worth, its all about what the market will bear.

Having neither seen the boat or aware of the local market where it is being sold, these comments are based on what I would consider when purchasing a similarly equiped boat.

[CaptainB360]

All rigging and hardware I got through West Marine. I'm trying to think back to what I used on the wood (this was a while ago) and cannot recall the product name. Regardless, sanded everything down and applied 3 coats.

Again, I appreciate all of the feedback - and what you are suggesting for resale is along the lines of what I was assuming it would be - which unfortunately isn't even close to what I have into the boat. Will have to ponder whether sail it, sell it, or turn it into a permanent show piece in my garage...

[Peterw11]

Unfortunately, like cars, boats are worth what they're worth, regardless of the amount of time and money you sink into it.

Like restoring an old car, a certain model has a peak value, unless it's got some highly unusual or desirable attributes which may make it worth more. No matter how much you invest, once you surpass that value, you aren't gonna get it all back.

But there's also the old used car adage, "the right ass for the right seat", meaning that there is a buyer out there who is looking for a boat just like yours, and is willing to pay top dollar for it.

All you have to do is find him.

[Spaulding]

Is your boat still available? Contact me directly if so.
Sp.