This is my first real sailboat I also have a snark sunflower please don't flog me... I picked it up today and it needs a little work nothing major or that I cant handle. I'm not sure of the year but it was registered as a 74 but I don't think thats right due to it not having a 12 digit number. Hull # 10176 Class # 1783 any additional info that anyone may have or want to share is welcome. The sails are good needs new running rigging and some wood replaced as well as the rudder rebuilt or replaced but over all its not terrible. Pics in link. Added my gallery to this.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/db8d325hk22h ... 6AyQa?dl=0
gallery/search.php?user_id=3545&display=popup
New to me DS1
Moderator: GreenLake
9 posts
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New to me DS1
by om3ga83 » Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:00 pm
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- om3ga83
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- Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:26 pm
Re: New to me DS1
by Lil Maggie » Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:46 am
Welcome to the brotherhood and the forum!
I own #2313 and I sail with the spinnaker from #1728. From your pictures I can tell that you have some issues that you must address before attempting to rig and sail your boat. There is lots of info here o this forum that will help you get your boat back in tip-top shape. The most critical issue is the missing thart seat on the starboard side.This is a critical structural item on your boat. You will need to fabricate and attach a bracket on the centerboard trunk, then mirror the port side thwart and make one/install it. Next, and just as important is your cuddy coaming (lip). Your p.o. drilled holes on the edge of the cuddy w/o regard of the consequences of water intrusion into the rebar reinforcement in the cuddy lip. There are several ways to deal with that issue, you can see in my gallery how I dealt with it in my boat (probably overkill) but you already have a crack started on the starboard cuddy side and need to reinforce it before it gets bad.
There are several hardware issues you might want to revisit, I would recommend new standing rigging and a new rudder blade. Here is a great source for parts: http://www.drmarine.com
Very reasonably priced and a great source of knowledge and experience with these boats.
The next issue is foam flotation: back in the day they used styrofoam for buoyancy and the problem with that is that it absorbs water with time and makes the boat HEAVY....You need to cut holes under each seat and forward compartment, pull out all the old flotation and replace with pool noodles. Then cover your holes with inspection ports; this is how I did mine:
In the last picture you can also see how I dealt with initially with my sagging cuddy. This is an OK way to do it (Jack post), just make sure you rig your boat and tension your shrouds before you measure the height of the jack, because the hull will compress some, increasing the height between keelson and cuddy top.
Another area you might want to look at is the wood backing around the lower gudgeon mounting bolts...water tends to seep into the wood backing, causing it to rot. People here have removed and replaced the whole thing (not hard to do), I chose to just cut off the affected wood and replaced it with a solid piece of epoxy-saturated oak; you'll want to put epoxy on the bolts to waterproof the holes (or alternately use bedding compound). My repair looks like this:
Take a look at your halyards; I had the original wire rope/dacron halyards which were frayed and were causing tears and holes in my sails so I replaced mine with all-dacron halyards.
It seems like a lot of work but it really isn't...I purchased my boat back in 2012 for $350.00 with a trailer and for about that much extra I had it sailing (advantage is I know how to work on f/g-wood-epoxy), and I spent a little more later because I bought new sails, etc and then I ended up sinking some dough on my trailer which was slowly pounding my boat to death, but concentrate on the boat first. You will love sailing the DaySailer...very easy to single-hand
Cheers;
Mike
I own #2313 and I sail with the spinnaker from #1728. From your pictures I can tell that you have some issues that you must address before attempting to rig and sail your boat. There is lots of info here o this forum that will help you get your boat back in tip-top shape. The most critical issue is the missing thart seat on the starboard side.This is a critical structural item on your boat. You will need to fabricate and attach a bracket on the centerboard trunk, then mirror the port side thwart and make one/install it. Next, and just as important is your cuddy coaming (lip). Your p.o. drilled holes on the edge of the cuddy w/o regard of the consequences of water intrusion into the rebar reinforcement in the cuddy lip. There are several ways to deal with that issue, you can see in my gallery how I dealt with it in my boat (probably overkill) but you already have a crack started on the starboard cuddy side and need to reinforce it before it gets bad.
There are several hardware issues you might want to revisit, I would recommend new standing rigging and a new rudder blade. Here is a great source for parts: http://www.drmarine.com
Very reasonably priced and a great source of knowledge and experience with these boats.
The next issue is foam flotation: back in the day they used styrofoam for buoyancy and the problem with that is that it absorbs water with time and makes the boat HEAVY....You need to cut holes under each seat and forward compartment, pull out all the old flotation and replace with pool noodles. Then cover your holes with inspection ports; this is how I did mine:
In the last picture you can also see how I dealt with initially with my sagging cuddy. This is an OK way to do it (Jack post), just make sure you rig your boat and tension your shrouds before you measure the height of the jack, because the hull will compress some, increasing the height between keelson and cuddy top.
Another area you might want to look at is the wood backing around the lower gudgeon mounting bolts...water tends to seep into the wood backing, causing it to rot. People here have removed and replaced the whole thing (not hard to do), I chose to just cut off the affected wood and replaced it with a solid piece of epoxy-saturated oak; you'll want to put epoxy on the bolts to waterproof the holes (or alternately use bedding compound). My repair looks like this:
Take a look at your halyards; I had the original wire rope/dacron halyards which were frayed and were causing tears and holes in my sails so I replaced mine with all-dacron halyards.
It seems like a lot of work but it really isn't...I purchased my boat back in 2012 for $350.00 with a trailer and for about that much extra I had it sailing (advantage is I know how to work on f/g-wood-epoxy), and I spent a little more later because I bought new sails, etc and then I ended up sinking some dough on my trailer which was slowly pounding my boat to death, but concentrate on the boat first. You will love sailing the DaySailer...very easy to single-hand
Cheers;
Mike
A crappy day sailing is better than a good one at home...
DS 1 #2313
DS 1 #2313
- Lil Maggie
- Posts: 134
- Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:57 am
- Location: Dover, NH
Re: New to me DS1
by GreenLake » Sat Aug 05, 2017 2:51 pm
Welcome to the forum!
Mike's very thorough post covered all the highlights (and then some). It's very thorough; hope it doesn't scare you off
It's almost like having your very own surveyor's report.
Take heart: most of the needed or recommended repairs on a DS1 are pretty manageable affairs. That's the beauty of these boats, and why people manage to keep them sailing for 60 years or more in some cases.
You can probably sail your boat in between making some of the upgrades, but some should be attended to sooner than later. Others you may defer to the end of the season.
Because your boat has one thwart left in place, the CB trunk isn't totally unsupported; that's good, because otherwise you risk cracking along the place where the CB trunk meets the bottom of the hull; nevertheless, the missing one seriously compromises the strength of the overvall structure by letting the hull flex by widening and narrowing. While duplicating the mahogany seat would be ideal, a piece of marine plywood would do to get the structural support (and give you time to get the esthetics right later).
The best way to attach a bracket on the CB trunk would be epoxy glue (after sanding and degreasing both CB and the bracket). Not the hardware store "syringe" kind, but something like T-88 or GelMagic from SystemThree (or mix your own using West System). Glues are usually formulated to be non-sagging, which is what you want for the vertical application.
My DS1 has some cracks on the vertical sides of the cuddy opening (but none along the top). These cracks have not changed in many years. If those are the only ones and you can step on the cuddy deck without it flexing unduly, you may postpone that repair. I would, however, unscrew all the fittings and seal all the holes with unthickened epoxy (e.g. laminating epoxy like SystemThree's SilverTip, or, if you are in a colder climate, get some SystemThree ColdCure which will be handy for working during the shoulder seasons). (All epoxies need to be meticulously measured and mixed - getting that right is half the battle).
Sealing these holes is important to avoid the rebar hidden in the top of the cuddy from rusting. Once you get rust in there, the repair gets much more time consuming.
Getting the old foam out is definitely recommended, but you don't have to postpone sailing. When you select inspection ports for this, get the absolute largest that will fit. Makes it so much easier getting the old stuff out. Pool noodles are great - however, I used the "blue" styrofoam insulation instead. It's less prone to being waterlogged than the old white stuff, and now that I have the inspection ports, I can monitor these areas. In my case it was the wrong season to get pool noodles locally and I wanted to be on the water sooner than I could get them shipped to me.
All running rigging needs to be replaced occasionally: rope gets stiff over time. Look for my post "Rope for various lines" in the Rigging section of the forum to get some ideas; you may over time want to follow the examples I give, or decide that some other kinds of rope works best for you. Mike uses dacron (polyester) for his halyards, I've switched to Amsteel which stretches less and is comparable in that way to the old wire halyards. Both have their advantages.
Standing rigging (wire stays) should be replaced when you see any hint of rust on it, or if you think it's original to your boat. If it fails, you will bend or lose your mast. Check out the tangs that connect to it on the mast (including all rivets) and the chainplates on the side of the hull. These are essential items, and you should be confident that there are no issues - generally these can be OK even for a boat your age, but a critical look is better than blissful ignorance.
Rudder blade: I would not buy a new stock rudder blade. The design isn't all that efficient and if you spend that money, might as well get something better. Or make your own.
Have fun and enjoy your DS!
Mike's very thorough post covered all the highlights (and then some). It's very thorough; hope it doesn't scare you off
It's almost like having your very own surveyor's report.Take heart: most of the needed or recommended repairs on a DS1 are pretty manageable affairs. That's the beauty of these boats, and why people manage to keep them sailing for 60 years or more in some cases.
You can probably sail your boat in between making some of the upgrades, but some should be attended to sooner than later. Others you may defer to the end of the season.
Because your boat has one thwart left in place, the CB trunk isn't totally unsupported; that's good, because otherwise you risk cracking along the place where the CB trunk meets the bottom of the hull; nevertheless, the missing one seriously compromises the strength of the overvall structure by letting the hull flex by widening and narrowing. While duplicating the mahogany seat would be ideal, a piece of marine plywood would do to get the structural support (and give you time to get the esthetics right later).
The best way to attach a bracket on the CB trunk would be epoxy glue (after sanding and degreasing both CB and the bracket). Not the hardware store "syringe" kind, but something like T-88 or GelMagic from SystemThree (or mix your own using West System). Glues are usually formulated to be non-sagging, which is what you want for the vertical application.
My DS1 has some cracks on the vertical sides of the cuddy opening (but none along the top). These cracks have not changed in many years. If those are the only ones and you can step on the cuddy deck without it flexing unduly, you may postpone that repair. I would, however, unscrew all the fittings and seal all the holes with unthickened epoxy (e.g. laminating epoxy like SystemThree's SilverTip, or, if you are in a colder climate, get some SystemThree ColdCure which will be handy for working during the shoulder seasons). (All epoxies need to be meticulously measured and mixed - getting that right is half the battle).
Sealing these holes is important to avoid the rebar hidden in the top of the cuddy from rusting. Once you get rust in there, the repair gets much more time consuming.
Getting the old foam out is definitely recommended, but you don't have to postpone sailing. When you select inspection ports for this, get the absolute largest that will fit. Makes it so much easier getting the old stuff out. Pool noodles are great - however, I used the "blue" styrofoam insulation instead. It's less prone to being waterlogged than the old white stuff, and now that I have the inspection ports, I can monitor these areas. In my case it was the wrong season to get pool noodles locally and I wanted to be on the water sooner than I could get them shipped to me.
All running rigging needs to be replaced occasionally: rope gets stiff over time. Look for my post "Rope for various lines" in the Rigging section of the forum to get some ideas; you may over time want to follow the examples I give, or decide that some other kinds of rope works best for you. Mike uses dacron (polyester) for his halyards, I've switched to Amsteel which stretches less and is comparable in that way to the old wire halyards. Both have their advantages.
Standing rigging (wire stays) should be replaced when you see any hint of rust on it, or if you think it's original to your boat. If it fails, you will bend or lose your mast. Check out the tangs that connect to it on the mast (including all rivets) and the chainplates on the side of the hull. These are essential items, and you should be confident that there are no issues - generally these can be OK even for a boat your age, but a critical look is better than blissful ignorance.
Rudder blade: I would not buy a new stock rudder blade. The design isn't all that efficient and if you spend that money, might as well get something better. Or make your own.
Have fun and enjoy your DS!
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
- GreenLake
- Posts: 7309
- Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:54 am
Re: New to me DS1
by om3ga83 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 5:50 pm
Thank you for the input. Most of what was mentioned is on my list of things to do. All the wood is being replaced all running rigging will be new. The halyards will be replaced I am good with fiberglass work there are a good bit of little holes that were drilled in the cuddy that are going to be repaired. The rudder falls in with the other wood it will also be made as well as the tiller. I payed 400 for the boat and trailer and expected to spend some time and money in it but also plan to get it back in the water this season. We will also be painting it. I will be posting pics along the way. First thing is to get it all cleaned up. Thanks again I have been looking through the forum and gathering information you two just confirmed what I had planned.
- om3ga83
- Posts: 10
- Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:26 pm
Re: New to me DS1
by Lil Maggie » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:15 pm
Keep us posted on your progress and post lots of pictures...Like greenlake said, it sounds like a lot, but I think it took me two weeks of afternoons to get my boat sail ready. Enjoy!
Mike
Mike
A crappy day sailing is better than a good one at home...
DS 1 #2313
DS 1 #2313
- Lil Maggie
- Posts: 134
- Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:57 am
- Location: Dover, NH
Re: New to me DS1
by om3ga83 » Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:03 pm
I plan on it as we progress I will post pics in my gallery. Today we set the boat on the ground to clean and start sanding it to do repairs and get it ready for paint. Also going to have to do some work to the trailer but thats the easy part for me as I do metal fabrication. This boat has apparently seen better days and has had a few patches and repairs done to the hull they all look good and like they were well done but I am going to check over everything and make sure. Im also going to do some other custom work but I will update and share when that starts happening. Thank again to everyone following along keep checking the gallery for updates and progress I will also up date here as the work happens.
- om3ga83
- Posts: 10
- Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:26 pm
Re: New to me DS1
by om3ga83 » Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:07 pm
looks like I have to add a center board to the list of things added in to make/fix. Also I'm not sure if the one that was in the boat is a factory one or not its hallow and has three pieces of rebar in it, It also is a different shape than the rotten factory wood and glass one that I have. found the hollow CB thread... so I have two very different CBS but guess I will build one
Last edited by om3ga83 on Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- om3ga83
- Posts: 10
- Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:26 pm
Re: New to me DS1
by GreenLake » Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:37 pm
Looks like a standard one to me. And the rebar seems to be par for the course for those early boats.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
- GreenLake
- Posts: 7309
- Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:54 am
Re: New to me DS1
by om3ga83 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:03 pm
After I looked around last night I came to the conclusion that it was just a stock one.
- om3ga83
- Posts: 10
- Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:26 pm
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