Rustoleum for boat paint

[adam aunins]

This is a list of link that go with this topic


http://forum.daysailer.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2293

http://forum.daysailer.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2420

It is said that this is where a lot of this started
http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/sho ... art=1&vc=1

You can search rustoleum on youtube and find lots of videos on it.

From what I've read it seam that you need to go against convention and thin the snot out of the paint, then put lots of very thin coats of paint on until you have built up enough paint.

[ctenidae]

We just finished painting #1114 with Rustoleum. Worked pretty well. We did 2 coats of primer (which in retrospect was unneccesary and probably served to build up brush strokes that later were a pain), and then 8 coats of well-thinned white paint. Generally thinned the finish coats out to milk consistency.

First few coats, which naturally set up the final result, weren't put on as well as they could/should have been (cold weather, a dodgy heater in the garage, and inexperience with both Rustoleum and the intricacies of tipping). However, with a zillion coats and plenty of elbow grease sanding between, we're really happy with the outcome (I'll post a picture eventually, I swear). Up close with good light, you can certainly see it's not a pro job, but at 20 feet, she's a beaut.

All that said, I've seen quotes in the $300 to $400 range for a strip/repaint of a boat this size, and I'm not entirely convinced it wouldn't be worth it. It's not a terrible project, but one where mistakes are costly in terms of time adn effort, and having proffesional tools and talents makes a huge difference in the final outcome.

[ctenidae]

Did a coat on the deck with Interlux Premium Yacht Enamel. Looked great- super smooth, really shiny, excellent flow. Problem was fisheyes. Not sure wehre silicon contamination (or any other kind) might have come from, but sure looked like it. Wandering about, went into a Lowes, found Rustoleum Topside paint. Put a coat on, no fisheyes, filled nicely, brushed and tipped most, but then just brushed on on the seats. Both flowed out nicely, minimal strokes showing.

Head to head comaprison, go with the Rustoleum. $11/quart vs $22 for the Interlux. Comparison based on amateur brushing skills only, adn does not account for wear and tear or other events. Your mileage may vary.

[GreenLake]

Thanks. Don't forget to let us know the results after your first year of use!

[Roger]

Not sure that all manufacturers would agree with this, but my chandler told me that Rustoleum (our brand name here in Canada is Tremclad but its the same thing) is the same formulation as another major brand of yacht paint. That being said, I painted my boat a few years ago with Tremclad, and it still looks good. It does scratch easily as it is a bit of a soft paint, but since you can get touch up cans in half pint sizes as well as quarts, it costs little to touch it up. I think it took me two quarts to do my DS II. I usually retouch every couple of years, but no need for a full paint job yet.

[ctenidae]

Went out and scraped off the barnacles this weekend (waterline ended up being about 2 inches above the molded-in bootstripe, oddly, so we didn't paint bottom paint up far enough).

Have to say, the Rustoleum didn't hold up all that well- not surprisingly especially where it was regulalry wet, but even further up, not great- some cracking and blistering. It is also pretty soft, adn scratches pretty easy. We'll do touch ups, which should be easy, but I'm not entirely satisfied.

Of course, with no real basis for comparison, maybe it really held up comparatively well. Seems a painted boat is always going to have issues not found in the original gelcoat, but the paint really let go and flaked badly in some places.

[algonquin]

Of course, with no real basis for comparison, maybe it really held up comparatively well. Seems a painted boat is always going to have issues not found in the original gelcoat, but the paint really let go and flaked badly in some places.

I agree with your general statement about paint in general.

I have painted FG boats with both standard Rustoleum and a similar product called X-O Rust. With a lot of attention to prep and primer I have had really durable paint jobs with both brush and sprayer. I did add a slight amount of hardener in the premix. I found that the best finish results from letting the primer dry then lightly sanding it with 320 or smaller grit before applying the first color coat. I also wet sand after the first color coat has dried a few days then shoot or brush the final coat. This method results in a very durable long wearing surface. Keep in mind that in this process less paint is better than more paint and will help avoid those soft spots in the paint later on. Brad

[GreenLake]

Went out and scraped off the barnacles this weekend (waterline ended up being about 2 inches above the molded-in bootstripe, oddly, so we didn't paint bottom paint up far enough).

Is your bootstripe actually at the waterline? I dry sail my boat, and usually am in a hurry to leave the dock, but I found a photo recently that showed the stern deeper in the water than the waterline by about 1-2" for a fully rigged, but otherwise empty boat (well, there was about 120 lbs of battery and motor in the cuddy).

Have to say, the Rustoleum didn't hold up all that well- not surprisingly especially where it was regularly wet, but even further up, not great- some cracking and blistering. It is also pretty soft, and scratches pretty easy. We'll do touch ups, which should be easy, but I'm not entirely satisfied.

The DS is small enough that touch-ups should be manageable efforts. But if a more expensive paint allows you to do the job only every other, or every third year, I'd say you come out ahead.

I've just used Pettit's EasyPoxy (not an epoxy, despite the name) on a rudder. I liked how easy it was to apply, but have real concerns about how soft it feels and how easily it seems to scratch (and that is before I've had a chance to use the thing in the water).

When I repaint the hull, I'm leaning toward System Three's water-reducible linear polyurethane. I've used their clear version of that extensively and am happy with the results, and a friend has done his dinghy in their white. It needs a little more care in applying and promises to be very hard. (I also like the water-reducible part)

I have probably mentioned that already, but there's a publication, Practical Sailor, that does tests of paints, chemicals and other boat related items on a continual basis - they're like that other magazine dedicated to product testing and free of ads.

Of course, with no real basis for comparison, maybe it really held up comparatively well. Seems a painted boat is always going to have issues not found in the original gelcoat, but the paint really let go and flaked badly in some places.

I have a painted hull on my DS1, done by some previous owner with paint from International. It held fine for many years until it finally failed (crumbled) in some spots. Most of it is firm enough to have survived several bouts of not overly aggressive pressure washing.

An early failure like this (flaking, blisters) always raises the suspicion that you might have had remnants of wax, or worse, silicone in your gelcoat, or that you either didn't sand to give the proper "key" or that your sandpaper left it's own residue. Can you describe what you did as prep, before painting, preferably with details?

[ctenidae]

The bootstripe is clearly pretty well below the waterline, which strikes me as a pretty strange place for a bootstripe...

The flaking of paint that I'm seeing certainly looks like poor adhesion to the surface. The yacht paint we used on the topside showed fisheyes, which makes me think silicon. The old paint job was a couple layers of house paint over a dark blue that seemed like an enamel. We removed it all with citrus-based fiberglass-safe stripper, then sanded the entire hull with a couple different grits to get a smooth (but not shiny) surface. cleaned it twice with acetone and a few times with water. We did fill in some surface dings and rough spots with epoxy. Gave the whole thing a coat of Rustoleum primer, and painted 3-4 coats of thinned paint, roll and tip. Sanded between coats lightly, and let dry at least over night, longer depending on the week.

Not sure what else we could have done for prep. The bottom paint stuck to the primer just fine. Other places that showed damage were from scrapes that dug deeper than I would have expected from the relatively light contacts. Inside, however, the paint held up quite well, despite being multiple layers of different kinds of paints (primer, then garage floor paint, then topside yacht paint).

[GreenLake]

Thanks, that's detailed and reads as if you followed the standard recommendations fairly well. And if you thinned your paint properly any softness would seem to be inherent to your paint.

Random thoughts:

There are some "non-clog" sandpapers that are supposedly able to leave a residue. Could you have used those? Ditto for tack cloths.

I keep reading a recommendation for de-waxing before the first sanding, lest wax/silicone gets ground into the freshly sanded surface. Possibility?

If you were spreading silicone around, would acetone have removed it at the later stage?

Flaking: between paint and primer or between primer and gelcoat (blue) or between layers of the paint? Might give a clue.

Location of damage: this is a topside paint, so some failure might perhaps be expected at the edges if the boat was sitting deeper in the water than you had planned on. If the paint ended up being effectively submerged, then that would be a nice explanation if it failed mostly there.

[ctenidae]

Definately the majority of failure is in the unexpectedly submerged parts- water clearly the problem there. I didn't do a thorough survey, just looking as I was scraping, but I got the impression is extended further up than I expected.

Not sure of the source of the probable silicon contamination (as evidenced by fisheyes in the yacht paint). There were multiple layers of various types of paint on the boat (probably lightened the whole thing by 20 pounds striping it), so could have been anywhere in there.

Where the paint flaked off, it's down clean to the gelcoat.

[GreenLake]

So looks like you had adhesion problems between primer and gelcoat. There's something called a fiberglass solvent wash, which is formulated to get residue off bare gelcoat, in preparation for painting. It may do a better job of getting certain contaminants than acetone.

Then there's the question of your sandpaper. Was your final grit too fine? Was is "non-clogging" and hence left a residue of its own?

Random thought: If the primer for your bottom paint didn't fail - perhaps use that one next time?

Anyway, you shouldn't have to redo this after only one season.