Replacement Carbon Fiber Mast?

[K.C. Walker]

So, I broke my mast over the weekend. Don't ask… I already feel stupid. I've been looking for replacements and there are several options in my neighborhood, Dwyer, Kenyon (rig-rite), and Forte Carbon Fiber.

It looks like that Dwyer DM – 284 is very close in cross-section to my Allspar. I can move a lot of my old parts over and I don't think it would cost me much more than $450-$500.

Well, I couldn't help myself and I had to call Forte Carbon Fiber and ask. They said they'd love to turbocharge a DaySailer. The carbon fiber mast would weigh half as much as aluminum. They would engineer it with a tapered tip so that it would have even better gust response than my bendy Allspar. I could move some of my hardware over but I would need more new stuff. The estimate for the raw carbon parts with some machining done is $1350. My guess is that it would run $1500 + or -.

My only experience with carbon spars is with windsurfing and its amazing how much better it is to have a light mast in that circumstance. I'm not sure how much difference it would make on the DaySailer. In talking with Forte, they say I would be totally amazed at the difference. I'm sure it would be good, and I could rationalize amortizing it over the rest of my sailing life.… Which, might end up being longer because of how much easier it would be to step a mast that weighs half as much.

So, should I be talked out of this and just get on with replacing the aluminum mast? Or, does anyone else think this is worth considering? I know, this is an O'Day DaySailer… Get real K.C. !!!

[Mike Gillum]

K.C.,
Where did it break and what's the damage? Photographs? Mike

[K.C. Walker]

Mike,

I'm afraid I snapped it in half at the spreader brackets. I haven't looked it over super carefully to see how much more damage there is. I can see it's dented right at the masthead, and of course the spreader brackets are toast. I think that the mast sections left are still straight and the ends aren't too chewed up. Though, I should examine them more carefully to be sure of that.

[GreenLake]

K.C.,

I would be the last to talk you out of experimenting with your DS.

It's a lot of money. Curiously, even though you'd be definitely abandoning the last pretense of fitting into the class envelope, the result might be that you will be even more committed to the DS than before. If you are successful in tweaking your DS so it really fits your sailing style and sailing area to a T, that is.

So we'd all be very curious in finding out whether a carbon mast really makes a noticeable difference in everyday daysailing - but you really shouldn't feel obligated to go through with it on that account.

[Alan]

+1 on what GreenLake said about curiosity.

[Bob Damon]

While it has not been said yet, a carbon fiber mast is not class legal. Reference Bylaw 3, paragraph 7.1: the mast shall be of an aluminum alloy with an internal sail slot. If class legality is not a concern, try it and have fun! Thanks, Bob Damon

[K.C. Walker]

Green Lake,

You are right about being even more committed to the DaySailer if I were to invest in an even more expensive carbon mast (not my usual style). I've considered at times the amount that I put into my boat and realize that I would never get a return on investment (which is far from my usual style). But, if I were to have bought a new one, I certainly would not have expected to get a full return.

Right now, if I wanted to be competitive in the class, first off I'd have to be a better sailor… and find committed crew… and find a fleet closer than 2 ½ hour drive… AND, then there would be major expenses to make my boat class legal. I would have needed an expensive mast regardless, in this case. I also would need a new set of racing sails, as mine are not legal because the main is loose footed and has a top full batten. Also, I have seriously the wrong spinnaker, and the list goes on. Though the hull on my boat might be desirable for racing, the rest of it would need a full re-riq, I'm afraid. So, though I haven't done anything to disqualify my boat from being class legal, so far, I also haven't moved towards making it more class legal. I think if I did want to race this boat, I would be looking to buy another one to do a parts swap with.

However, you're right, as a day sailer, this one fits my style and location amazingly well.

[K.C. Walker]

Thanks Bob! I know I'm getting a bit far afield here.

[GreenLake]

K.C., I've solved the issue a different way. I got a separate boat for racing.

That puts me back in the class of people that use the DS for daysailing, and in that context, class rules become rather irrelevant (Sorry, Bob).

Actually, the full relevance of class rules depends not only on whether you use your boat for racing, but also on whether there even is any racing under class rules in your area.
If there's no fleet or potential of one, resale value isn't affected by whether a boat is or can be brought back to class specs.

Not the case in my area, and what racing I've been doing has been "free-for-all", and is mostly done with boats that are "upgraded" in interesting, but usually "cheap" ways. Like the way my current boat has a spinnaker even though that class doesn't know about one.

And so it goes.

[Mike Gillum]

We rebuilt an old tapered Proctor that sheared at the hounds (shroud & forestay area) from too many fastener holes (old & new) by sleeving 12" on both sides of dameged area and welding Humpty Dumpty back together again.
Ended-up with a slight bend to port from the heat generated by the welding but it was structurally sound afterwards.

[Bob Damon]

Just an FYI, there is a fellow parting out a DS1 just north of Boston and you might be able to get a replacement mast at a good price!

[K.C. Walker]

Thanks for the heads-up Bob!

[TIM WEBB]

Aw, man, so sorry to hear that KC!

Broke my mast 3 years ago (dearly departed shroud shackle), but (luckily?) it broke right where a hinge would go, so I put one there.

Although the carbon fiber porn might be appealing, I think I'd have to vote for trying to get another regular one, or trying to repair ...

... on the other hand, would it be worth the $$ to be the first (as far as we know?) to give it a try?

(C'mon jdoorly: you're the king of DS customization awesomeness - you KNOW you want to chime in here! )

[jdoorly]

Hi Tim, here I was thinking that all the dots have been crossed on this subject when I remembered reading in the May/June 2033 "Scientific Canadian" magazine that a new breed of Japanese Beatle has evolved that eats carbon fiber, voratiously. The resulting excrement, which is all the same tiny size and color, is shaped like a miniature head bust of Al Gore. A large infestation of these beatles in San Francisco has just devistated the America's Cup Regatta. The brood of beatles is now headed South eating all the expensive boats along the way. Well, so much for CF! Except I did wrap a spiral of CF tape around my tiller in the hope that it might last another 40 years... Oh, and we do tie CF tapes to our Maypole out back and dance around 'em, but hey, everybody does that!

I just completed a project to lengthen my mast using an inside sleeve made of the same extrusion as the mast (but with the sail slot cut off) and it was so simple and straight forward and came out so well that I wouldn't hesitate to use that technique again to fix a broken mast. The long handled riveting tool from Harbor Freight is large enough to install the 3/16" stainless rivets (mine actually broke on the last rivet and I had to use an aluminum rivet and a standard length tool to install it). Harbor Freight- almost good enough...

FYI: I picked up my mast pieces at the Dwyer shop in North Branford CT, it turns out that the DM284 extrusion isn't used much and that is why we make our own sleeves, most other extrusions have real sleeves that fit perfect and are available for purchase.

NOTE: If I didn't already have a good system for raising my mast singlehanded I might be more interested in a feather-light CF mast.

[TIM WEBB]

"2033 "Scientific Canadian" magazine"?!

Wow: you really are from the future, just as I suspected!