installing a mast gate?

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installing a mast gate?

Postby K.C. Walker » Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:16 pm

I've been contemplating a mast gate to hold the sails slugs in the mast slot. This one looks interesting and I wondered if anyone has installed one? http://mastgates.com/Home_Page.html
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Postby jeadstx » Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:29 pm

I use a stop for the sail slugs. This is the one I use http://www.sailrite.com/Sail-Track-Stop-Flat-42

I attached a small line to it and attached the line to the mast with a screw to prevent losing it.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
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Postby K.C. Walker » Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:40 pm

John, yes, I should tie a line to my sail stop. I've lost two of them so far.

The reason I'm thinking of a gate is that I would like to have the slugs be able to slide past the opening. It would make it easier for rigging, reefing, and stowing the sail on the mast.
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Postby TIM WEBB » Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:22 pm

DOH!

- the answer to what I just posted ... :oops:

BTW, how exactly did you attach the small line to the sail stop?

Oh, nevermind, just answered my own Q - I see the hole in the flat part ...
Last edited by TIM WEBB on Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby jdoorly » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:43 am

These mast gates are pretty cool. I especially like the internal one but I don't think it is an option for the DS. I just measured my DM284 mast and the track depth is about 0.050 shy of the 3/16" clearance required (i.e. 1/8" lip plus 3/8" slug plus 3/16" for the gate. Of course you can shave off the slugs if you want, or get the external type.

I installed a quick and dirty gate to augment my stop last spring. It was just a plate hammered into a curve with 2 screws tapped in the mast. I am hoping to upgrade it to something more automatic such as the gates KC is looking at. By I'm choking on the price so I'll probably make my own version. I think a 3/4" x 9" x 1/32" strip of aluminum bent into a slow curve, slid into the track and screwed in on one end should give me the automatic internal gate I want for about $7.
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Postby jdoorly » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:29 pm

OOOPs, that didn't work, still thinking...
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Luff rope

Postby holstein » Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:52 pm

Are there any advantages of a luff rope over the sail slides ?
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Postby K.C. Walker » Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:02 am

I don't believe there is any advantage to a bolt rope. Though, to be class legal for racing you need to use that set up. I much prefer the sails slides. I think with this sail track gate that it will complete the setup.
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Postby GreenLake » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:27 pm

I can see the convenience of slides when you can leave the sail rigged between uses. But what about those who dry sail their boats and unbend the sail each time? Slides would seem so much more fiddly than feeding bolt-rope into a slot.
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Postby K.C. Walker » Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:53 pm

Green Lake,

Interesting, I find feeding the bolt rope to be fiddly. Maybe it was my boat. I always had to carefully feed the bolt rope with one hand while hauling the sail up with the other. It always seemed like another hand would have been helpful. My modus operandi is to raise and douse sail while underway, usually single-handed. If the slides are fiddly at least it's done in the parking lot before launching. Check out this short video. Does this seem fiddly to you compared to a bolt rope? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zB86FML ... r_embedded
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Postby jeadstx » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:10 pm

I find using sail slugs a lot easier than the bolt rope. My bolt rope got jammed more than once. I haven't had any problem with the sail slugs jamming in the slot.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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Postby GreenLake » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:53 pm

K.C. Walker wrote: I always had to carefully feed the bolt rope with one hand while hauling the sail up with the other. It always seemed like another hand would have been helpful. My modus operandi is to raise and douse sail while underway, usually single-handed. If the slides are fiddly at least it's done in the parking lot before launching.

K.C.

OK, it's boiling down to sailing conditions again. I attach the sail when I'm in the boat at the dock, and raise it immediately. So there's not as much benefit to me in separating the steps of attaching and raising the sail.

Some boltrope designs need more babying when raising. My old sail had a bolt-rope encased in sail cloth. That did not jam and was a snap to use. The new one has the boltrope that's sown to a tape which is then sown to the sail. That one does need guiding or it will jam.

I'm still just as fast raising it alone as with a helper, but by now, I've worked out a routine that compensates for the missing third hand.

Nice video, and I can see the attraction to be able to raise and douse the main quickly and positively, just that those situations tend to be rare the way I've used my DS.
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Postby jdoorly » Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:27 pm

Holstein- I believe there's small inefficiancy in airflow as windward air (high pressure) can leak to the leeward side (low pressure but faster) of the mast/sail foil through the slug/slide-attached mainsail. BYW slugs are used with a boltrope channel and slides run along a track that is attached to the back of a mast, but these definitions seem to be evaporating.

Greenlake- when I first got my DS it had a boltrope main and a hank-on jib. I had never before used a boltrope main but I already knew I didn't like hanked sails compared to furlers (except they can be jiffy reefed which is cool). After a few sails it became my number one first priority to convert the main to slugs, which I did with my trusty little grommet kit (Isn't it fun to bang things with a hammer?), and, after purchasing a new Intensity main and jib I converted the main to slugs AND removed the jib hanks and put it on a furler.

My big reason was so I could leave the sail on the boom and the boom on the mast stub. But I hated the way I had to feed every foot of luff to raise it and had to pull the sail down to lower it and especially didn't like the way the sail fell uncontrolled all over the boat having lost its' attachment. I did like the smooth and wrinkle free furl but that doesn't count for much since I don't race and I actually like nice soft sails.
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Postby hectoretc » Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:26 pm

jdoorly wrote:These mast gates are pretty cool. I especially like the internal one but I don't think it is an option for the DS. I just measured my DM284 mast and the track depth is about 0.050 shy of the 3/16" clearance required (i.e. 1/8" lip plus 3/8" slug plus 3/16" for the gate. Of course you can shave off the slugs if you want, or get the external type.

I installed a quick and dirty gate to augment my stop last spring. It was just a plate hammered into a curve with 2 screws tapped in the mast. I am hoping to upgrade it to something more automatic such as the gates KC is looking at. By I'm choking on the price so I'll probably make my own version. I think a 3/4" x 9" x 1/32" strip of aluminum bent into a slow curve, slid into the track and screwed in on one end should give me the automatic internal gate I want for about $7.


Jay - maybe it wasn't you, but in my ongoing scouring of the old posts on this board, I'm nearly certain I saw a reference from you about a mast gate commercially available for about $20 and posted a website. I've looked and looked and can't find it again... Does that ring a bell to you?
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Postby jdoorly » Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:40 am

Yes, I vaquely recall admiring someones mast gate handiwork, but like you I cannot find it again, although Tom Luques website and internal mast gate product seem very similar but 3 times the price. I've spent some time playing with my own designs, which are similar, but cannot improve on his basic gate.
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