Whisker Pole Question

[GreenLake]

Hi greenlake

I read your post regarding bamboo spin pole and would like your input regarding a variation of it to be used as a whisker pole for my jib on a DS 1. I don't have a spinnaker

How much length Would a WP need for wing on wing sailing? How high up the mast should the attachment be?

Could a telescoping boat hook be modified for use as
WP and if yes, what gauge or diameter?

Thanks for all u are doing for us newbie sailors

Flandersfrank

Before I had a spinnaker pole, I used a paddle for the purpose. On some light wind run before the wind several years ago I discovered the need for a pole. I had a paddle and a short bungee cord. I wrapped the bungee and knotted it around the point where the handle attaches to the shaft of the paddle. That left the two "hooks" stick out. I hooked one of them into the clew, braced the blade of the paddle against the mast (at cuddy level) and tightened both jib sheets. Voila. I could sail wing on wing with this setup.

Given this experience, a telescoping boat hook would probably work. In lightish airs, the forces on a whisker pole for a DS appear quite manageable.

A spinnaker pole (or whisker pole) is usually not attached at the mast base, but at a ring that's fixed a couple of feet off the deck in front of the mast (between 24" and 48" per class rules). If your mast does not have such a fitting, it can be retrofitted easily enough. If you have a fitting but it's too high or too low for your purpose, the rules allow two of them.

A class legal spinnaker pole is up to 74" long. That's how long my bamboo spinnaker pole is. I can't recall offhand whether I've used or tried to use my spinnaker pole as a whisker pole and with what results, but I would not be surprised if I concluded it was a bit long for use as a whisker pole. Otherwise, I probably be using it now for that purpose; instead, I still tend to use the jury-rig with the paddle.

Depending on how your boat hook is set up, you might add a bungee cord to one end to give you a "hook" on the handle side of it, so you have a hook on either end. Then you can experiment with the length. I think you will find that some particular length is optimal, and then build a dedicated pole for that size. (Unless your boat hook turns out to be as convenient as my paddle ).

I like repurposing stuff that I already have on the boat - up to a degree. At some point making something that's optimized for the task might be the right thing to do, but even in that case, a jury-rig can be a good prototype.

My experience with bamboo (1" inner diameter, so I could fit the plastic spinnaker pole fittings) is that it is a very lightweight material. On another dinghy I purchased, the prev. owner had put together an aluminum pole, and it wasn't stiff enough, so he doubled it up and it became quite heavy by comparison. I had to add a single layer of glass cloth in epoxy (wound in a spiral) to my pole to prevent it from drying out and splitting. Even with that, it's lighter, and now it's nearly impervious to being stored outside during the season.

Anyway, good luck with trying to find the optimal setup.

PS: I have always found that dead downwind, a DS sailed wing on wing is nearly as fast as with a spinnaker. It's at some other angles closer to a broad reach that the spinnaker really makes most of the difference.

[Swashbuckley]

Been thinking about a whisker pole for my DSII, and I really like your DIY bamboo idea. Durable, cheap, replaceable....

[jeadstx]

I carry a whisker pole. Mine is a telescoping type that I got on eBay about 6 years ago for I think $25. The mechanism that allows it to telescope tho has jammed, so it is currently a non-telescoping model. I've tried fixing it with no luck, but it is the right length for use, so I'm leaving it that way.

John

[GreenLake]

John, what length did your pole "settle" on?

[jeadstx]

It originally was a 4' pole extendable to 8'. It jammed in the closed position and trying to get it work again I managed to get it to about 5-1/2 feet, maybe a 2" less. I'll probably leave it there as it seems like a compromise for using with the Day Sailer and the Mariner. As I recall, when I used it on the DS (when it was working), I would extend it a little.

John

[GreenLake]

John, your size is a bit longer than my jury-rigged paddle. That one is 55", but I use it at an angle, so it's effectively a bit shorter. When you write "I would extend it a little", do you mean that 48" (its unextended length) is too short? I'd agree. I think the optimal length is greater, not smaller than the length I get with my jury rig. Some suggestions on the forum run all the way to 80". Need to experiment again with my full spinnaker pole. Next time.

[GreenLake]

Here are some previous posts on this matter:
Whisker Pole -- Tim Webb suggests 80", jdoorly describes converting a boat hook
Whisker Pole In this thread, Bob Hunkins suggests:

I would pole out the jib while the boat is on the trailer as if you were running and mark the location on the mast where the pole is perpendicular to the mast to get the most projection for the jib.

Whisker pole recommendations In this thread, Bob Damon writes:

For cruising a longer pole is a a little better but for our jib size only out another 6" or so.

Then there is the issue of jib sheets not being long enough:

my whisker pole is a 5' wood spar with a 3/8" wood peg glued into one end and a 6" loop of 1/8" line through a hole in the other end. the peg is stuck into the clew of the jib, the jib is wung out till the loop on the other end can be looped around the downhaul cleat on the mast. the jib sheet is tensioned to hold the pole in place...voila! a simple, old, and effective version
ps my pole could be longer to allow the jib to be wung out to 90 deg, but my 'shortish' jib sheets wont allow it. i'd suggest making a longer pole-say,6'- and then checking it in place on the boat to get a length that works on your boat. my "spar" is a 3/4 x 1" piece of syp

and so on...

If Bob (Damon) is right about the longer length for cruising, I should really try my 74" pole instead.

[GreenLake]

OK, I went out and tried the spinnaker pole as a whisker pole. I can see where it adds a bit of projected area over the shorter paddle I had been using. Whether adding a few additional inches (from 74" to 80") would make a further difference, I couldn't predict. Ultimately, most of the area is always close t the luff, so further pushing out the clew should have diminishing returns.

Next up some more tests of how much difference a spinnaker makes compared to wing-on-wing (spinnaker definitely makes a big difference when the jib can't be poled out).

PS: I think the reason I don't routinely use my spinnaker pole for wing on wing had more to do with the fact that my jib sheets are a bit too fat for the jaws. And, that I'm more inclined to rig the spinnaker, anyway. But I'm convinced there are occasions where poling out the jib is the better scenario. (Not necessarily in a race, though).