Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Moderator: GreenLake

Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon Dec 14, 2015 9:43 am

GL,

I was able to get my vang lower, so the fairlead angle is good now. You mentioned flipping it and "rigging to advantage". I did not follow you on that one. Can you clarify?
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby GreenLake » Mon Dec 14, 2015 11:34 am

If the line that is "outside" the purchase pulls in the direction of it, so that it helps move the movable end of the purchase, its pull contributes to the effort. That's what's meant by "to advantage". If you flipped your purchase around so the line exits at the top and pulled down towards the fairlead, you'd get that extra pull. Or, think of it this way, the fairlead would become like an additional sheave of the bottom of the purchase.

I'm still concerned about the distance fore-and-aft of fairlead and anchor point of the vang. As the boom swings out, you are now pulling sideways on the bottom of the vang. Again, if you turned your purchase around, the line would exit at the top, and you can see how what would change the geometry so it always pulls (mostly) down, with only a small sideways component. (It would mostly be aligned with the purchase, even at the extreme angle of the boom, in contrast to your current setup).
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon Dec 14, 2015 12:26 pm

Got it now :) Thanks for the clarification!
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby jeadstx » Tue Dec 15, 2015 4:09 am

I measured the jib tracks on my DS II and the overall width is 5/8". That seems to have been a standard for O'Day on several classes of boats. My Mariner and my Rhodes 19 also use the same jib tracks.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby DigitalMechanic » Sun Dec 20, 2015 7:41 pm

So, my brother and I sailed the boat today. Spent about 4 hours on the river. We sailed the piss out of the boat! I think she finally knows who her daddy is ... :)

All the mods worked great. The mainsheet setup is great. It would allow me to really take advantage of the puffs, because I could hold the sheet in hand prior to the puff coming on, and then when the puff was on, I could trim the sheet and tiler simultaneously on the fly. Definitely a rush if you get it right... The winds were a little strange, as it would be extremely moderate and sometimes dead, and then come on really strong. The most memorable gusty moments were upwind when we found ourselves gliding through the water with the boat on her side, bouncing up and down through the waves. I am not sure what it is about the boat slamming into the waves and making the water spray, but definitely one of my favorite moments.

The jib sheet setup worked pretty good. Obviously it is setup for single handing, as they cleat off back at the centerboard. This also makes it easy to stay out on the edge of the boat when sailing with two, during those exciting moments when the wind is really up. My only gripe is that my foot snagged on them a few times when going forward on the boat. I never tripped, the jib sheets just casually reminded me that they were there by keeping my foot from moving the extra inch or two forward that I would have liked.

The boom vang mod, at least for my skill level, was more than adequate. I never felt like I needed more. The boom was easy to pull down, even when the sail had it loaded.

All in all, this is probably one of the most fun sailing days I have had. I think all the hard work and modifications have paid off. I can't wait to sail her again :)
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby TIM WEBB » Sun Dec 20, 2015 8:52 pm

Good on ya DM! Yeah, we've still got remnants of this front that came through, and the winds are pretty fluky down here as well ...

Ain't it great when you get *your* boat setup the way *you* like it, and the learning curve just starts to go through the roof, er, deck? ;-P
Tim Webb
1979 DS2 10099 The Red Witch
(I used to be Her "staff", in the way dogs have owners and cats have staff, but alas no longer ... <pout>)
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby DigitalMechanic » Sun Dec 20, 2015 10:00 pm

I do not know how else to explain it... It was the perfect day... Thus far. Everything that was thrown at the boat, the boat seemed to handle, with minimal stress on then skipper. Wind on, no wind, heavy wind, puff on over heavy wind. Crazy kind of day. It was the perfect conditions to show every aspect of the what the boat and the rigging were capable of. very very fun. I am telling you... that fat part of the St. Johns is mysteriously delightful at times.
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby GreenLake » Sun Dec 20, 2015 10:09 pm

This is where we would need a "like" button. Happy to read about how well your mods turned out for you, DM.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby DigitalMechanic » Sun Dec 20, 2015 10:20 pm

LIKE! ...button... lol...
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby jeadstx » Mon Dec 21, 2015 3:28 am

I'd like to hit the "Like" button as well. Glad to hear that all your modifications are working well.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:07 pm

TIM WEBB wrote:Good on ya DM! Yeah, we've still got remnants of this front that came through, and the winds are pretty fluky down here as well ...

Ain't it great when you get *your* boat setup the way *you* like it, and the learning curve just starts to go through the roof, er, deck? ;-P


Yep, it was in the low 30's degrees at night and 50's-60's during day over the weekend. Then today, it was 80 something degrees again. I now have a cold as well. That seemed to happen overnight, lol. Florida weather...

The boat would sail before, but now it is so much easier to adjust, and more importantly take advantage of the wind speed changes. Really fun to sail now! I remember cruising and then the puff coming on, and the boat would go over a bit, but not enough to worry, as you could ease the main ever so gently when need be, and then sheet back in... she would start increasing speed quickly, and then when things would start level out a bit I would pull the mainsheet back in some more, and it would power up more and start to "haul tail"... we were skipping along through the water once we really got it trimmed in good and all the tattle tails were flowing nicely... Slamming into the waves and causing the water to spray. We were sheeted in enough in a heavy puff at one point, that the tiller was trying to run away, had to keep a fair amount of pressure on it to keep from trying to round up. But sheeted in enough, and forcing the tiller slightly to windward in the gusty winds made for some pretty fast sailing. Or at least the fastest I have done ;) The boat's controls seemed a little chaotic at this point, but the adrenaline was was there to offset that as a concern.

Before, it would be like... "oh crap there is a gust", and go down into the boat and let out the mainsheet, and the boat would stop excessively healing, but it would also stall quite a bit because the mainsheet would get let out to far because no ratchets or you don't really know how to judge how far to let it out because you cannot make an easy determination because you cannot adjust from sitting position you want to be in on the rail of the boat because the mainsheet is auto-cleating in the downward position. Basically, the "Marine Nitro" would come, and you would lose it and have to start the whole shifting process again from scratch in 1st gear.

The mainsheet setup is A++ in my opinion :D
The other mods make things a lot more convenient...
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby jeadstx » Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:01 am

Not only will your modifications improve the sailing of your boat, getting to know the "feel" of how your boat responds will improve the more you get it out.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
jeadstx
 
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Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 11:10 am
Location: Dripping Springs, Tx

Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby TIM WEBB » Fri Dec 25, 2015 11:26 pm

Just goes to show ya: you're never quite sure what you're gonna get when ya get out there, and then you're still not quite sure! All I know is that it's better to get out there and find out than to stay ashore and wonder your whole life what coulda been ... ;-P

Merry happy Christmahannukwanzikas everyone!
Tim Webb
1979 DS2 10099 The Red Witch
(I used to be Her "staff", in the way dogs have owners and cats have staff, but alas no longer ... <pout>)
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby SUNBIRD » Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:30 pm

On my boat the cleat is on an arm mounted under the fiddle-block (double-block on CB trunk), the cam-cleat is mounted on the top of that arm and the sheet is cleated by pulling slightly down, released by pulling up. I just figured all of the Day Sailers that came from the factory with mid-boom sheeting (basically all 1975 and later) had the same setup. After viewing multiple pictures in my DS II library..... I see that I was wrong. Scary, since I would almost always prefer having it rigged as mine is, and I can't really think of any case where I would not want it like mine (although, there must be some times when it would work better).
I might sometimes need to apply a bit of pressure with my foot to seat the sheet into the cam-cleat if I'm sitting on the rail (and can not pull sheet down into the cleat), but it is nice to be able to quickly pull the line up out of the cleat to ease the sail In a puff. Actually, I sometimes jokingly talk of using my foot as a "winch" to tweak the mainsheet in just a bit more, by stepping down on it to give a bit more pull in!
anyway, I'd check to see if there is any way to flip that cam-cleat over and mount it to allow pulling up to release. Most likely not possible, but still worth looking at.
Last edited by SUNBIRD on Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Rod Johnson, "SUNBIRD"
1979 DS II, # 10201
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Re: Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:10 pm

anyway, I'd check to see if there is any way to flip that cam-cleat over and mount it to allow pulling down to release. Most likely not possible, but still worth looking at.


Well sorry, I think I forgot to come back around and post a followup on this one... Human memory, lol.

So this is the original mod where I flipped the cleat vs the whole new setup that eventually came of all this...

Basically, the cleat flipped up did not help to much. On a reach, the angle would get too extreme, and an even worse situation would occur... You couldn't un-cleat without crossing the boat... Not very relaxing :shock:

I love the new setup (was a bit pricy but worth it). Basically, I can hold the sheet in hand now, or clamp it off if my hand needs to go elsewhere for a few. I put an auto-ratchet on the boom, which also makes it super easy to hold onto the sheet when I want to sail with it un-cleated (which is fun fun stuff).
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