Mainsheet setup and Purchase System

[DigitalMechanic]

I am with you. I already copied you for the most part. Instead of leading the vang all the way to the back of the cockpit, I just put a little fairlead between the existing horn cleats for the halyards, and then ran the vang to a cam cleat on a a riser at the cuddy's edge and let it drape over the opening.

[Salty Dog]

I debated about doing that and not cutting a hole in the cuddy top, but I went ahead and put a thru deck sheave and a turning block hanging on an eye on the stump inside the cuddy level with the top of the CB trunk. then ran it over the top of the CB trunk to a swvl cleat w/fair lead mounted on top of the CB trunk ahead of the main sheet in the cockpit.

I ordered a whisker pole from WM , so I maybe set for awhile. I will put the boat in the water next month and see if it will float. If not I guess its back to the drawing board

[Salty Dog]

digitalMechanic

I just reread your post about my halyard blocks. Actually there were no blocks on my mast. just small horn cleats for the halyards. I had seen the blocks and horn cleats on the cuddy on the older models and thought that would be better than trying to reach the mast to cleat the halyards. so I rigged it up like the older models. I guess they started cost cutting measures at the time the made mine, 1983, . if you look close at the pic. you can see where the small cleat used to be right behind the cheek block.

SD

[GreenLake]

FWIW, I have the horn cleats on the mast and they work fine. It's very rare that I need to access them under way, and if I do, I stand in the cuddy - might be different if I had to climb on the foredeck...

[DigitalMechanic]

Just went out and grabbed a picture. Here is what I did with mine. It is similar, but does not come back to the cockpit like yours. I bet it is nice to have it conveniently located in the center of the boat.

I think that I might not have the best fairlead placement on mine. The angle may be kind of sharp. I may have to either work on pulling it down closer to the cuddy top, or move that fairlead back a bit.

[GreenLake]

I think that I might not have the best fairlead placement on mine. The angle may be kind of sharp. I may have to either work on pulling it down closer to the cuddy top, or move that fairlead back a bit.

If you replace the fairlead with a block and move it forward, closer to the mast, you can then then turn around your purchase and have it "rigged to advantage". Or move it back, as you suggest. As it is placed, it will pull the base of the vang to the centerline of the boat and that's not what you want.

[DigitalMechanic]

I just reread your post about my halyard blocks. Actually there were no blocks on my mast. just small horn cleats for the halyards. I had seen the blocks and horn cleats on the cuddy on the older models and thought that would be better than trying to reach the mast to cleat the halyards. so I rigged it up like the older models. I guess they started cost cutting measures at the time the made mine, 1983, . if you look close at the pic. you can see where the small cleat used to be right behind the cheek block.

Mine actually have the horn cleats as well, so maybe that was a corner O'day started cutting even earlier with the non DS I models? It maybe that someone added the blocks later on my boat? I think they are kind of convenient, as you can pull back away from the mast and stay under the boom when hoisting sail. I can get my sail up pretty quickly in the wind, especially with with 2 sets of hands, and I always have to raise it on the water in the wind. I have to motor out past a few bridges before I can set sail. But for that convenience, I guess the price is that occasionally the jib sheet catches on one.

[Salty Dog]

GL

yeh mine worked fine also. I also stood in the cockpit. it is a little bit easier with bigger cleats and a little closer. the original cleats were real small about 2". I hope I don't have trouble with the jib sheet hanging on the cleats.

SD

[Salty Dog]

DM

I noticed that yours has the jib track on it. The PO took them off my boat but I've been wandering if I should put them back on. I don't know if the adj.is worth the effort and money.

SD

[DigitalMechanic]

I hope I don't have trouble with the jib sheet hanging on the cleats.

I don't, it is the eyelet that the blocks on the jib sheet are connected to that occasionally snag on for me. Usually in lighter air, cause the sheet can sometimes have a tendency to sag just enough to catch the outer edge of the metal eyelets.

I noticed that yours has the jib track on it. The PO took them off my boat but I've been wandering if I should put them back on. I don't know if the adj.is worth the effort and money.

I just leave them be, but I am not experienced enough to appreciate those minimal tweaks. I think that in really light air, you might push them forward more to loosen the foot and leach of the sail. You may pull them back in heavier air to tighten the foot and leach to spill a little air. (I think I have that correct). For cruising, I think that there are plenty of other ways to power up and de-power. If you were racing or needed an extra edge for entertainment, then you could add in that variable for fun. I think that is is probably a minimal return though. Just my 2 cents, but again I am probably not the best resource at this point.

If mine were missing I would not replace them at this point, as I have yet to really worry about adjusting them. My assumption is that you would have a better investment in jib in-haulers first vs that mod, if you do not already have them.

[DigitalMechanic]

On another side note. Those tracks go into a piece of "glassed in" wood behind the coaming. On my boat that wood was rotted out, and you can probably guarantee yours is as well if the tracks are missing. I had to go in through an inspection port on the side part of the bulkhead in the cuddy to put a piece of marine plywood behind the coaming where the track would go... as a backer board to add support to the coaming. When I first started modifying the jib sheet to pull toward the inside of the boat instead of the back of the boat, that was a major concern, as I did not want the track to pull out of the coaming. It is a nasty job (the inside of my boat is disgusting, lol), but the marine plywood makes a huge difference. Just wash you hands around 10 times afterwards

[Salty Dog]

Thanks

I think I will hold off on that then.

SD

[GreenLake]

When it comes to trimming the jib, the relation between position of the fairlead and the wind speed is neither linear nor unidirectional. For both very light winds and very strong winds you may want to put twist in the sail, albeit for different reasons. For stronger winds, putting twist in the sail will depower the top, reducing heeling moment. For winds 5 knots or less, the airflow over the water becomes laminar, which means that its speed will change gradually as you go higher along the mast. If you add the boat speed, which is constant, you will get more forward apparent wind angles near the deck (boat speed dominates) than near the top (wind speed dominates).

From about 6 knots and above the wind flow over the water becomes turbulent. That means that there is only a very narrow layer right above the water where the wind isn't at full speed. Beyond that, the wind speed is the same up and down the mast (if there's any variation it's much smaller than for laminar flow). That means, for the sweet spot (6-12+knots more or less) you'd want to trim your sail so it has the least twist, so all parts of it draw evenly.

As you go from no wind to high winds, you start at back end of the tracks, which will flatten the foot and open the leach, allowing twist, then as the wind increases move to the forward end end, and eventually back again.

The same out-in-out variation happens with barber haulers, and the same story about when you'd like to permit more vs. less twist applies to the mainsail as well.

[DigitalMechanic]

And I knew someone was going to provide the real explanation that you were looking for

Again, I am not 100% sure, but from what I understand the barber hauler would be more bang for your buck, and probably easier to use, especially while wind is in the sail... which potentially makes the boat more fun to sail. I am not sure about the cost comparison, but I would think the implementation of in-haulers is better in price. Actually, the tracks may be fairly costly if you have to start form scratch. Parts to include, tracks, sliders/cars, blocks (maybe reuse your current ones), cleats, and fairleads. What you spend on the later items will depend on if you cleat the jib sheet off on the track or come to the center of the boat. Actually that parts list starts to make in-haulers sound sweeter by the moment (cleat, rope, block... and possible bullseye or fairlead).

GL,

I know you have in-haulers on you boat. How often do you adjust your tracks considering you have the in-haulers?

[K.C. Walker]

A few of the national champions that I've discussed this with say that they leave the track block all the way forward at all times and use the barber in-haul as the means to control jib twist. I use both, especially when I single-hand. At moderate wind speeds I use the barber haulers, at 12+ kn when I am overpowered, I move the track block back to spill as much air up top as I can, and… especially if it's a condition where I reefed the mainsail.