Bilge clear out while underway

[Watson]

Would like to manually pump out bilge while sailing. Can I simply run guzzler hose down through inspection port while sailing or is keeping it open not recommended, even for a few minutes during benign conditions and with partner?

Other option I am considering is installing 12v pump under cuddly floor. Would prefer to avoid that if possible but if anyone has instructions for the install, I would appreciate it.

Thank you!

[tomodda]

I don't sail a DS2, but.... (these are famous last words! anyway this is gonna be my opinion)

I'd be fine with opening an inspection port while underway and sticking a hose or manual bilge pump down there. If things are calm enough that you can fiddle with a hose, then things are calm enough to not worry about an open port into buoyancy spaces. That being said (written), why are you taking on so much water into your bilge space? By definition (enclosed bilge), it shouldn't be taking in spray or rain. Is your centerboard leaking? Seems as if DS2's like to leak thru the downhaul/uphaul openings. You may want to check that first, plenty of info in this forum.

By the way, there's no such thing as a dry bilge. We're just spoiled from fiberglass boats. I spend a few weeks this summer on wooden boats, great fun. Especially watching the seams between planks spurting water as we pounded along. Tack, tack, BAIL, tack, BAIL, tack.... Truth is that sailing any small dinghy is much the same, try an FJ or a Finn in a good breeze!

Tom

[Watson]

Thanks for the reply, Tom! I ramp launch and rig every time I go out so I try to stay out as long as possible. Depending on conditions it takes on a bit after a couple hours and I’d like to be able to have a nice afternoon 3-4 hour sail without having to worry about it. Some days on the haul out it’ll drain on the ramp for 30 seconds and others it may be a good 2-3 minutes. Was just thinking if I could drain it a bit during the ride, I could have a more pleasant home stretch of the cruise. Happy holidays!

[GreenLake]

Tom covered the two main points. Track your source of water into the bilge. There's a lot of discussion on the DS2-specific challenges in that regard, but these are not wooden boats. The space between the hulls should stay dry.

And, yes, you can breach the airtight seal, as long as you are smart enough about keeping the capsize risk at effectively zero. One DS2 I sailed on had a set of ports in the coamings; these were added for installing hardware, but later used to dispose (closed) plastic water bottles during longer voyages. But, the openings also had mesh bags so you could store small items securely and out of the spray. Needless to say, each access breached the watertight integrity of the cockpit molding (=inner hull).

As long as you make sure not to keep ports unscrewed for a second longer than necessary, all these secondary uses are quite probably fine.

You could leave your collection of water bottles in the space between the hulls - out of the UV they simply work as reserve buoyancy (by preventing any water that gets in from filling the entire available space). Some people do that deliberately and use a dab of sealant to improve on the tightness of the caps. The skipper of that boat instead retrieved the bottles afterwards and started the process anew each season.

[Watson]

This is very helpful. Thank you for the reply.

[Shagbark]

Fix the leak and you don't need to bother with how to bail.

[Champlaner]

I used a simple approach to the leaking centerboard cable hole, as opposed to the often described tapping and inserting a plumbing nipple etc. I taped the cable to hold it to one side while I filled half of the 360 degree gap with thickened epoxy using my pinky and gloves. Wiped off excess, let dry and repeated for the opposite side. I don't remember if I cleaned with acetone first or put a little neat epoxy (and wait for partial set) as a bonding layer, but both of these would improve the bond. Worked great for me--I think. I say that because I took some more drastic steps in 2 other areas. First, my boat came with no autobailer but just a hole and a plug on the cockpit floor. Not knowing what was going on in there led me to fill the whole thing with thickened epoxy. I had taped the bottom of the hull but maybe could have spent more time with that to keep it flush. Second, I plugged my cockpit drain which was located part way up the transom. I was pretty sure this was not the source of any bilge water but the thing was useless as it was at the wrong height.

I now have only 1 drain in the boat--the bilge drain at the bottom of the outside of the transom. I trailer now, so the boat needs to be covered at home or it fills with rain. I still get a very small amount of water in the bilge when sailing but not enough to care. I sail in pretty bumpy conditions sometimes and find I almost never get more than a splash in the cockpit. Making sure you have functional flotation under the seats and in the bow is key. I used to moor the boat and um it was up to it's gills once. I was able to tow to shore with dinghy, bail with a 5 gallon bucket then hand pump and went sailing. But once was enough. The flotation saved me.

Boat leak crop.jpg (86.48 KiB) Viewed 17525 times

[GreenLake]

A picture worth a 1000 words!

Did you wax your cable before you added the epoxy?

Some places you can get epoxy that's not just thickened but has metal filings in it. That would seem to me the best way to approximate a plumbing nipple. What I mean is that it would resist "sawing" as the CB is moved.

[Champlaner]

I didn't use wax but a good idea. I don't think sawing is the issue since the gap between the 2 fiberglass walls is minimal. You would see evidence of sawing on the glass--and maybe need to do the nipple. In my case both holes looked intact but there was no evidence of any old filler between the walls. It had all fallen out. The fix is easy enough that after a few years if it fails you could clear it out with an "L" shaped bent nail or similar and re-epoxy.

I was really impressed that she didn't sink, especially since I didn't make it to the lake until 4 days later by virtue of a missed call. I think a lot of people have the same flotation under the bench seats--blocks of foam held to pieces of wood with resin. Both of these assemblies are somewhat broken loose from their original attachment points and can get wet by sitting on the bilge floor. Removing them to replace with pool noodles was on my list but the job would involve lots of cutting by reaching through the inspection ports in order to fit the pieces out. So I usually make sure they are propped up somehow when at home or at season's end to let the foam dry. Maybe I'll slide a pool noodle or 2 underneath the assemblies since noodles won't get as soggy as the old foam. But that foam dries out nicely so it's OK. I use nylon screening over the inspection holes with painters tape when drying the bilge. Screened caps would be nice. We get critters in our cars, riding mower engine and snowblower--they love air filters!

The whole episode was a great testament to how seaworthy DS II's really are. I sailed for three hours after emptying the boat and just had a few quarts in the bilge when I hauled out to start repairs.

Getting back to the thread title, I think I would heave to in order to hand pump while underway. Less multitasking. Hand pumps work fine.

[GreenLake]

Hand pumps work fine while you are in the boat. Heaving to is great for that purpose (unless you are cruising downwind with spare crew).

Let us know how your repair holds up. It sounds pretty simple to do.

[Quiggers73]

Dragging up an old thread, sorry.

I have had water in the bilge. Last week I left the auto bailer plug in afterwards, deliberately to let the sun dry the water up and kill the algae. But of course had a storm cone through and dump a bunch in the cockpit.

I suspect perhaps water leaked in through the inspection ports...

Question.

I understand the centerboard trunk houses the centerboard, and its hauled up and down via cables with holes on the front and aft of the trunk.
These are on top of the center board trunk and normally wouldn't get water in them unless raining I guess.

I am struggling to visualize if there's holes underneath where the center board comes up that would leak into the bilge.
The picture shows the hole in the cuddy.

Am I missing understanding structurally where it might leak underneath?

[ArchSail]

Not sure if this answers your question Quiggers. I have a 74 DSII with only the pivot bolt securing the centerboard. Both holes for the centerboard uphaul and downhaul cables are along the forward end of the centerboard trunk just inside the cuddy. When sitting in the cockpit, the thing we recognize as the centerboard trunk is a shell covering another trunk structure underneath. This means that the cables attached to the centerboard pass through one fiberglass wall, then a half inch or so of bilge space, and finally exit the holes I see inside the cuddy. So in theory, I could have water entering the bilge from the first set of holes. I could also have water enter the holes at the pivot bolt if something is wrong there. These should be above the waterline so some have suggested this should only happen under very choppy conditions or perhaps at trailer launch.

[Quiggers73]

Ok. That helps.

I saw another post where someone cut up a DSII, but I don't have Facebook, so have to wait for the wife to get home from work.

From what you describe, then water around the center board could make its way into the bilge if those holes for the cable are not watertight, regardless of whats happening above the trunk.

That helps me visualize the structure underneath. Thank you.

[GreenLake]

Not sure those would be my first guess for standing water to get into the bilge, because the level would have to be pretty high. Perhaps that was the case. However, they work their magic while underway. The water in the trunk is under pressure. So if you are going fast, water will squirt out the front. If you aren't using the usual trick (a pluming nipple) to connect the holes in trunk and shell, some of all of that water will end up in the bilge (if you have a good connection, any remaining water will go into the cuddy, and from there flow into the cockpit - one of the few special "features" of the DSII design that I have been privileged to observe in action).