tabernacle moves up and down

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tabernacle moves up and down

Postby BreezingUp » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:09 pm

I recently bought a Daysailer II with a tabernacle. I assumed the tabernacle was fixed to the foredeck, and when I first looked at the boat, I didn't even bother to check whether this was the case. Unfortunately, the first time I rigged the boat, I discovered that the tabernacle is attached to a tube that slides up and down. Despite this, I managed to step the mast, but later when I was lowering the mast by walking it down, the tabernacle slid up and the mast fell onto the stern.

Is the tabernacle supposed to move in this way? I am hoping the answer is no, and that there is an easy way to fix the tabernacle so that it can't move. If the answer is yes, then I must say that it is a very poorly designed feature.

I'd appreciate any suggestions. Thanks.
1982 DS II #12047
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby Alan » Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:37 pm

The tabernacle attaches to a mast stub, which in turn attaches to a compression post in the bilge. The compression post is fiberglassed into position and the stub is usually attached to it with screws. The screws pass through the cuddy floor into the compression post.

Here it is:

DSII compression post resized.jpg
DSII compression post resized.jpg (189.65 KiB) Viewed 3853 times
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby Shagbark » Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:08 pm

My DSII is built different from Alan's. It just has a mast step casting on the cuddy floor that the tube fits onto. Mine did the exact same thing, that is until I put a hose clamp on the tube just under the roof of the cuddy. Now when the forces try to pull up the tube, the hose clamp stops it. To protect the tube from the hose clamp, I wrapped a thick piece of rubber around the tube, under the clamp. Problem solved.
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby Alan » Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:02 pm

Shagbark, what year is your boat? Mine's a 1980. I'm wondering when O'Day decided to add the compression post.

I can see why they did add it--my cuddy floor is flexible when I climb in there, and I don't weigh all that much. Tightened shrouds and forestay generate a lot of downforce. The idea that all of that downforce is concentrated in a point load at the base of the mast, on a fiberglass panel that isn't especially strong, is kinda scary.
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby TIM WEBB » Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:43 pm

I think all DS2's have the compression post. The screws seen in the pic are holding the step casting to the cuddy sole, preferably directly over the post. The mast hinge instructions from D&R suggest drilling a horizontal hole through the stub/step casting, and using the forward hinge pin to hold the stub down while stepping/unstepping the mast. On TRW I just secured it with a SS self-tapper and never had an issue.
Tim Webb
1979 DS2 10099 The Red Witch
(I used to be Her "staff", in the way dogs have owners and cats have staff, but alas no longer ... <pout>)
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby BreezingUp » Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:07 am

Thanks for all your responses. I'm surprised to read this:

"The mast hinge instructions from D&R suggest drilling a horizontal hole through the stub/step casting, and using the forward hinge pin to hold the stub down while stepping/unstepping the mast."

"Suggest drilling a horizontal hole"? These are installation instructions??

I was also dismayed to read this:

"I can see why they did add it--my cuddy floor is flexible when I climb in there, and I don't weigh all that much. Tightened shrouds and forestay generate a lot of downforce. The idea that all of that downforce is concentrated in a point load at the base of the mast, on a fiberglass panel that isn't especially strong, is kinda scary."

All I wanted was a mast that was easy to step, and I thought the tabernacle sounded like a good solution. Now I'm thinking I bought the wrong boat.
1982 DS II #12047
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby Alan » Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:42 am

I think Tim's right, that all DSIIs had the compression post. Shagbark, may I suggest having a look in your bilge using a small inspection mirror lowered through one of the ports aft of the cuddy bulkhead, with a flashlight pointing at it? I'd bet you'll see the compression post lurking there directly below where the mast stub rests on the cuddy floor.
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby fatjackdurham » Tue Aug 01, 2017 6:43 am

So, if you mast stub has a mast step on the cuddy floor, then really all you have to do is put a couple of screws into it through the mast stub to hold it in place, not a big deal. Probably, the boat originally had a mast without a tabernacle and whoever converted it didn't secure it.
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby GreenLake » Tue Aug 01, 2017 9:31 am

BreezingUp wrote:All I wanted was a mast that was easy to step, and I thought the tabernacle sounded like a good solution. Now I'm thinking I bought the wrong boat.

That sounds a bit extreme as a conclusion. :D

The one thing I am surprised by is how the previous owner(s) have managed to step that mast for 30 years without securing it.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby fatjackdurham » Tue Aug 01, 2017 10:06 am

I know it's common to be a little despondent when you spend money and things don't go right. Read some of my posts about my boat, and you'll see your problem isn't so bad. But, that is part of boat ownership. They always need something, no matter how much you spend or what you get.

The Daysailer is a fine boat. Give it a chance. Even in the rough condition mine is in, once I got it sailing on a beam reach and saw the water rushing past the stern, I was thrilled.

Good luck.
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby BreezingUp » Tue Aug 01, 2017 10:27 am

Thanks for all your suggestions (hose clamp and screws). I'm really not sorry I bought the boat (I had sailed a Daysailer several times before I bought this one, and like it a lot) - just venting.

Out of curiosity, I'll ask the previous owner if he ever secured the mast stub.
1982 DS II #12047
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby BreezingUp » Tue Aug 01, 2017 11:06 am

The previous owner said he intentionally left the mast stub unattached so that if the mast is accidentally dropped, the stub will slide up, preventing the mast from damaging the top of the cuddy. But I'm not going to leave the stub unsecured - I'm just going to not drop the mast.
1982 DS II #12047
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby TIM WEBB » Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:00 pm

BreezingUp wrote:Thanks for all your responses. I'm surprised to read this:

"The mast hinge instructions from D&R suggest drilling a horizontal hole through the stub/step casting, and using the forward hinge pin to hold the stub down while stepping/unstepping the mast."

"Suggest drilling a horizontal hole"? These are installation instructions??

Yes. This is what comes with a new hinge from D&R:
2393
I was also dismayed to read this:

"I can see why they did add it--my cuddy floor is flexible when I climb in there, and I don't weigh all that much. Tightened shrouds and forestay generate a lot of downforce. The idea that all of that downforce is concentrated in a point load at the base of the mast, on a fiberglass panel that isn't especially strong, is kinda scary."

All I wanted was a mast that was easy to step, and I thought the tabernacle sounded like a good solution. Now I'm thinking I bought the wrong boat.

A couple of years ago, ChrisB's 1980 DS2 started developing a crack around the mast step in the cuddy. We were sailing on the FL 120, and he noticed that the shrouds were getting loose as the day went on. That afternoon he cleared all his gear out of the cuddy and saw the crack. He immediately pulled the boat out of the water, and back at home he cut out a section of cuddy sole, only to find the compression post completely out of alignment with the step. Wasn't even close, and presumably had been built that way. He replaced the post and cuddy sole section, and she was good to go!
Tim Webb
1979 DS2 10099 The Red Witch
(I used to be Her "staff", in the way dogs have owners and cats have staff, but alas no longer ... <pout>)
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby GreenLake » Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:24 pm

Our boats date from an era that was not famous for attention to detail quality in production. When you read the posts on this forum attentively you will find that for most older models of the DS there are fabrication techniques and quality issues that are a bit at odds with what we have come expect from modern mass-produced goods....

But that's what resources like this forum are for: to help you find out about these quirks and the best ways to work around them.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: tabernacle moves up and down

Postby fatjackdurham » Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:49 pm

Today, while my boat was off it's trailer, I had the same thing happen to me, the tabernacle going up and down when the mast crutch slid out. I cold see the whole floor of the cuddly move up and down about an inch. Not too worried about it, thought. The mast step is screwed in and the mast stub is riveted to the mast step. Presumably the compression stub under the deck is still there, too. When I raised the mast again, the shrouds and forestay were still tight.
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