DS III Centerboard Problems

Regarding the DS3 only. Note that the DS3 is not a class-legal Day Sailer.

Moderator: GreenLake

DS III Centerboard Problems

Postby Guest » Thu Jul 29, 2004 6:02 pm

I just purchased a 1990 DS III. It was looking great, on its trailer, not in the water for 3 yrs, sails, etc looked brand new, used little. On it's maiden vayage, the centerboard was down, all was well, had to pull it up due to shallow water and have not been able to get the board to drop since.The rope/cable pully system is intact but doesn't work. Boat is in the water. I am able to go under the boat and manually pull the board down and push it up, but there is a metallic grating noise. No obvious obstructions like gravel, roots or weeds, but the board is so enclosed in its box I don't know what to do. I don't even know who to ask to fix it. Any suggestions? Advice? Contact #s?

Elizabeth Matthews (elizamatthews-at-hotmail.com)
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Postby Roger » Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:45 pm

Your problem is not unique; infact quite common to the daysailer. Here is how your board is configured, (see link), a description of what has likely gone wrong and how to fix it.

The board has two lines attached to it. With the board up, you can actually get under the boat and see a nylon line that enters the centerboard at the front end accessible from under the boat. This line has a knot at its hidden end and is epoxied into the board. It will likely be intact, and not be the source of your problem. This line runs up the front edge of the raised centreboard and exits the centerboard trunk into the cuddy through the topmost hole, up to a set of blocks, down to the front of the cd trunk and through the cuddy bulkhead to the cleat at the side of the cb. This is the downhaul line.

The wire that is giving you the problem (metal grading sound) is attached at the top back end of the raised centreboard and runs forward along the top edge of the cb, then turns DOWN towards and through the lower front hole of the centreboard trunk, to a single block on the sole of the cuddy. Here it attaches to a 2:1 block assembly with a nylon line which runs back through the cuddy bulkhead and then the cleat on the cb trunk. This is the uphaul line.

This is likely what has gone wrong. When the cb is lowered using the nylon downhaul, the uphaul wire is slack, and if it is too slack may fall off to one side of the centerboard. When the cb is down, where this wire is attached to the cb with a metal tab, it is at the top rear. The wire should ride the top edge of the cb and stay taut. If it is slack however, it may ride to one side. Remember that the uphaul hole is forward and down from this position, so as soon as you pull on the uphaul, the wire will now be pinched between the cb and the cb trunk rather than riding the top of the cb. This is the metal grating sound that you hear.

The simple fix, if you can get away with it, (ie. this problem has not been happening for long so the cb is still smooth...), if the board is stuck in the down position you can try to fix it with one person under the boat to move the board left or right, [this can be done from one side with your feet] and the other person pushing the uphaul wire near where it inserts into the cb trunk from the cuddy.

If the board is in the up position, have someone push up on the back of the board from underneath to cause the wire to be slack. From inside the cuddy, what you want to do is to push the wire into the hole so that it again rides UP above the top edge/rear corner of the cb. You can then rotate the wire left or right so that it again rides the top edge of the cb. You will know when it is in position, because a slight pull on the uphaul is effective in moving the cb back, if it is in the down position. If you are trying to get a fix with the board in the up position, you will know that the wire is riding the top edge of the board again because there will be no grating sound and the uphaul assembly will take the load of the board when the person underneath stops pushing up on the back end of the cb.

Once you have got this fix accomplished, adjust the nylon line which is common to both the uphaul and down haul. You will note that it anchors on the cuddy floor on the left of the mast. Shorten it here so that the whole apparatus has limited play, only enough slack to cleat the line on the cb trunk. This snugness may be enough to prevent the metal wire from riding well above the end of the cb again.

If this does not work, (usually because the wire has ground the edge of the cb for a long time and caused some wear) then open the inspection ports on either side of the cb trunk on the cockpit sole and undo the two 3/4 inch nuts (you will feel them about 6 inches forward of the inspeciton ports) that hold the cb in place and lower it from underneath the trailer if possible, or careen the boat and anchor the mast down and do this operation with the boat on its side. (Some models have the cb pivot bolt held in place with two wedges instead, If this is the case remove the wedges to release the cb) You will have to regelcoat any damage to the cb, possibly straighten out the kinked wire, or replace it if it has pulled out of the tang. Check for any damage on the inside of the cb trunk as well, and repair any damage there. If there is a huge gap between the cb and the insides of the cb trunk, owners have been known to add shims about 12 inches in diameter to both sides of the cd held in place with the pivot bolt to fill this void, where the wire wants to go and grind! It is unlikely that this is your problem however as the wire is only 1/8 inch thick, and is grating which tells me there is only an 1/8" of space there.

See this link for pictures of the cb system. There are two pages of pictures. Look for the cb rigging scheme pic.

http://groups.msn.com/RogerConrad/shoebox.msnw?Page=1
Roger
 
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Postby Guest » Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:11 am

Roger, I just visited your website and can appreciate the photos, sometimes words aren't enough for us challenged folks. Tell me about the use of the "Boom Lifting line" you have posted? Purpose? Necessary for the DS1? Also you don't have an illustration for the CB on my 93 model do you? As far as how it is assembled. Thanking you in advance.

Dennis (dukelabatt-at-cs.com)
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Postby Peter McMinn » Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:18 pm

Roger, nice work on that website. Your inner tank shots inspire me to do the same on my boat--what a great way to really understand what's going on in there. Any chance of posting a DS1 manual?
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Postby psness » Thu Aug 05, 2004 2:00 pm

Roger, great photos. I recently rehabbed a 1979 DSII. I think I'll put some photos online somewhere. It took 2 months and needed some minor body work, painting, some new lines and I had the cb checked out and line replaced (I thought this would alleviate any common cb problems but we still have a cb stuck in the up position). We had some fun on our first sail (see recent post First Sail, Leak in Bilge and CB Problem). I have one question pertaining to our sagging boom problem (I figured we didn't have the main sail on correctly). I saw your topping lift. Is that standard equipment? The copy of my manual (from this web site) doesn't say anything about one and I didn't get one with the boat. Should one be added?
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Postby Roger » Sun Aug 08, 2004 1:44 am

Thanks for the positive feedback on the pictures, people.

As for a DS 1 cd rigging set up I do not have pictures, but if you check this website, Bob has some downloadable articles, one with a Spindrift manual which if memory serves me right is a DS I.

http://www.bobhunkins.com/mt-archives/c ... icles.html

Also there is an article with pictures on the DS I centreboard that may be of some use.

As for the topping lift, it is not original equipment, and as long as it is not attached to the deck of the boat to act as a backstay it is racing legal I believe. On mine, it attaches at the top of the mast as a small snap shackle on an eyestrap, runs down as a single 1/8" nylon cord (parachute shroud cord), then is blocked at the end of the boom, running back up to a tube cleat about 18" up from the back of the boom on the topping lift to make it adjustable. While sailing, it should be sloppy loose so as not to interfere with the leech of the sail. When flaking and storing the sail onto the boom, I take up the slack on the topping lift cleat and lift the boom a bit, (usually about an extra foot, to give it some clearance above my head while sitting) this prevents the back of the boom from crashing down into the cockpit as the sail is lowered, keeps the boom out of the cockpit while motoring, and places the boom in the right position, (tighten mainsheet to centre boom) and holds it there while you are either raising or lowering the sail. It is a convenience feature, but has no effect on sailing.
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Postby psness » Sun Aug 08, 2004 6:24 pm

Thanks for the info on the topping lift. Well, I was at the boat today and re-rigged the cb lines correctly and got it working. Yahoo!! One problem down, a couple more to go.

First - back to the topping lift - I think my main is too small and doesn't seem to hold the boom up properly. It doesn't go the whole way to the top of the mast and goes about 2 feet short from the end of boom when the foot is attached to the goose neck. Don't know if this is normal, but doesn't look right and the boom sags. I am going to start another thread regarding correct sail size for the DSII.

Second is a pretty bad leak in the bilge. I'm going to start a new thread for that as well.

Today was an absolutely beautiful day here in PA and it was tough since it was a work day instead of sailing. The lake was full of sails!

Thanks again for the help.
psness
 
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Postby Guest » Mon Aug 23, 2004 9:39 am

Thanks to all who responded to my request for help with my centerboard problem! Turns out the cable had come off the track, as Roger advised, bent back on itself and was kinked within the trunk: fished it out with a coathanger-highly technical. Worse, the stainless fitting was then bent over on itself. I was able to straighten it with linesmen's pliers! This is evidently a design flaw and I will have it remedied over the winter. Thanks again to all.

Elizabeth (elizamatthews-at-hotmail.com)
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DS lll centerboard problems

Postby Sleeper » Tue Jun 14, 2011 8:57 pm

I'm looking for a diagram and or pictures of the uphaul/downhaul lines on the DS lll centerboard. Same symptoms as original post: virtually impossible to raise and lower and grinding noise while attempting. Tried to access Roger's photos from 2004 but was unsuccessful. While I appreciate his description, I still can't visualize the lines. Obviously I need to take it off the trailer to work on this but was also looking for advice about tipping it on it's side or raising it up and building a cradle so the CB will raise and lower naturally as I attempt to figure out the problem and fix it. Thanks!
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Re: DS III Centerboard Problems

Postby drbmack » Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:33 am

My Daysailer3 got caught with a broken tiller and then when limping back with duct tape, a series if 60 mph micro bursts hit Lake Champlain resulting in me capsizing. After rescue by the coast guard, I was able to recover my boat and trailer it. However, my Center Board won't stay up. Does anyone have pictures of how to fix the cables etc if I lift it up off the trailer?
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Re: DS III Centerboard Problems

Postby GreenLake » Mon Sep 19, 2016 12:03 pm

Did you follow the link in the first post of this thread? (Also, I believe the DSIII and the DS2 are configured the same, or closely so, so you can read up on this in any number of recent threads in the DS2 section of this forum).
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: DS III Centerboard Problems

Postby jeadstx » Mon Sep 19, 2016 9:01 pm

It should be similar to late production DS II boats (1980 or later). As Greenlake said, check the DS II section, many posts there on this subject.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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