New Guy! Just got a DS III

Regarding the DS3 only. Note that the DS3 is not a class-legal Day Sailer.

Moderator: GreenLake

Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon May 02, 2016 9:37 am

One (with wire) raises the centerboard, and the other (rope only) lowers it. Hopefully you do not have to replace the rope... I am pretty sure you will have to careen the boat to do so, which may not be a problem as you mentioned painting. I believe some have also mentioned putting the centerboard back can be tricky. If you get to the point where you have to remove the centerboard to replace lines, I would check the hole that the uphaul wire goes through as well. It is a notorious leak spot (at least on the DS II). The DS III may or may to have that problem, but if it does some have used a pipe fitting/nipple inside the centerboard trunk to close the gap around the wire. Others have inserted a PVC pipe through the hole instead, but I believe that just squirts water into the cuddy. This is a problem/project that I have been putting off, lol. Not really looking forward to the whole careening process, don't really have a good spot for it.

On painting, not sure about your boat... but mine had the original gelcoat still. So, rather than painting I went the difficult route and undertook the project of compound (3m Super Duty Rubbing Compound), polish (3m Finesse it), and wax. I did several passes on the compound part (both hull and deck, but more passes on the deck), and then 2 passes on the polish. My boat shined up pretty well.

I would post a few pictures, but I keep getting an error that the "Sorry, the board attachment quota has been reached."
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby morrisammo » Mon May 02, 2016 10:25 am

My boat needs Paint, Top and bottom,, , the gel coat came and went,, a good two part epoxy paint, will do the job,

and I'll get the boat off the trailer and have to figure a way to get it up on its side without messing up the rail.

and I'll pull the centerboard, it might be a pain,, but better off doing it, upfront, when I'm working over the whole boat, that having it messed up, and half- A$$ed and having to pull it out of the water, after expecting to go sailing,, :oops: :oops:

more projects. but its all good.

I wish, I could find more Pictures,, when I work on cars I always look up the task on Youtube,, someone more than likely has posted a Video ,, I like being able to see what I'm getting in to,, before I have it all apart, and need,,, some unexpected part, or tool. a time saver and you learn a nice trick or two now and again.

aaaaaaa Monday,,, I hope to get some parts I ordered this week.
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby jeadstx » Mon May 02, 2016 3:27 pm

More than likely, the DS III uses plates on the bottom of the hull to secure and pivot the centerboard rather than the earlier system using a centerboard bolt like mine has. The plates make removing and re-installing the centerboard easier from what I have heard. The plate system began in the later DS II's and would have carried over to the DS III boats I suspect. If your boat uses the plates, you just have to make sure they are sealed well when putting the board back in.

The uphaul and downhaul lines for the centerboard on the DS III should be the same as the DS II. There are diagrams and discussions on the forum for working on the lines. D&R Marine sells replacement parts for the centerboard control lines for DS II and DS III boats.

Once the boat is "dry launched" you can careen it using the mast to get it on it's side.

Greenlake, the jib sheet snagging issue occurs on boats with a hinged mast. I've had it happen in both light and heavy winds when tacking. The jib sheets snag on the hinge plate or more correctly on the pins securing the hinge plate. Older boats use a smaller hinge plate. When the hinge pins are replaced, they are often longer than needed to work with the newer wider plates causing the jib sheet to more easily snag. Also the height of the hinge has a bearing on often the sheets snag. I think that the lower the plate is, the less chance there would be of snagging. A lower plate might allow easier covering of the pins to prevent snags. I've tried several types of thing to cover the pins. Of course, a non-hinged mast should eliminate most snagging problems.

I think from what I've seen, horn cleats with cheek blocks on the mast for the halyards are seen more on earlier boats. My 1976 DS II only has the cheek blocks on the mast and go to the horn cleats on the cuddy cabin. I like the horn cleats on the mast. My 1973 Mariner has that setup still.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon May 02, 2016 4:11 pm

jeadstx explained exactly how that works on my boat. I forgot that your mast is not hinged.

Placing the other end of the jib downhaul on a carabiner attached to the mast right above the hinge and check blocks helped solve that problem by ensuring the jib sheet is lifted up and over that area on a tack/gybe.
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby GreenLake » Mon May 02, 2016 4:33 pm

John, I don't have a hinged mast, but I have a "plate" at that location. It's for that hinged sleeve I use in mast-raising. I used to trap the jib sheet between it and the deck a lot. The simple fix was to bend a strip of aluminum to close the gap.
DSC08255-c_900.jpg
DSC08255-c_900.jpg (138.28 KiB) Viewed 6791 times

On the picture you can see the hinge and plate. (You can also see the halyards cleated to the mast, with the tails tucked away - the tails are cheap double braid, spliced to Amsteel for the portion that runs up the mast).

The strip I mentioned is visible just in front of the fairlead (it's a bit taller than the plate).

The fairlead is for a spinnaker halyard (that one I do lead to the cockpit, because the spinnaker gets raised and doused under way -- a lot). You can just see the other part of it on the other side of the mast where it leads to the spinnaker (ready for the launch in its plastic tub - not shown).

On the port side of the mast, a similar fairlead for the downhaul (blue/yellow line) is hidden behind the hinge plate. The thin green line is the (starboard) spinnaker sheet leading from the sail around the forestay.

The orange lines are miscellaneous ones (painter and some temporary line rigged just that day, for a long forgotten purpose).

The fat green line is my ludicrously overdimensioned jib sheet (a rope remnant that just had the correct length when I needed it). The thin black/white line on the left is the tail of the reef line. It's thin, but would be strong enough to be used as a halyard.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon May 02, 2016 7:12 pm

Wow! You just made my boat feel so simple... lol. I literally have 2 halyards, a vang, and a downhaul for the jib. So, my problem is actually probably a little enhanced by the fact that someone along the way (presumably) replaced the cheek blocks for a pair of eye straps with dangling blocks on them, in which my halyards would have previously run through. The jib sheet on my boat would occasionally get caught on the eye straps (as well as the tabernacle pins). Thus the pivot blocks moved the halyards aft of the mast, which would help, but also the need to elevate the jib sheet on my boat to bypass that area due to how it is currently rigged seemed necessary for now. This is because I have not yet removed the eye strap/block contraptions from the sides of the mast yet, as they might be a backup plan if the pivot blocks fail for some reason (I secured them with aluminum rivets). I have not had the pivot blocks on the boat long, but like them thus far, just testing the waters with aluminum rivets (no pun intended). If later in the season all has remained well, I will probably cleanup that area a little.

GL, I take it you corrected the attachment threshold issue?

In case anyone is still interested, here is the Hull buffing pics I was trying to add earlier.... Just saying, she was pretty chalky when I got her. That polisher changed a lot ;)

That latter picture is kind of a before/after shot (or really midway).
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Last edited by DigitalMechanic on Mon May 02, 2016 7:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon May 02, 2016 7:15 pm

Here is the eyestrap/block deal I was talking about...

You can also see the conflict that is created if the halyards are tied off on the horn cleats on top of the cuddy...
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Last edited by DigitalMechanic on Mon May 02, 2016 7:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby DigitalMechanic » Mon May 02, 2016 7:29 pm

Here is the new deal...

Vang is down, and no conflict with the halyards when the vang moves. Also, if I get rid of the erroneous eye strap/blocks then halyards are pulled aft of the mast enough to eliminate possible snags. The tabernacle pins are the only culprit left. Thus, the little piece of line (black and white) around the mast above the mainsail downhaul cleat (formerly know to me as Cunningham cleat, had to say it, lol), is where I latch the jib downhaul to to create the lift up and over the tabernacle when I tack/gybe.
Attachments
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby GreenLake » Mon May 02, 2016 7:57 pm

We had used our allotment for attachments (total) for the board.
I've upped that a little bit, but let's not go overboard.

Be selective, post the best picture each time. Also, if you think a picture might be referenced, do not use attachments, but use the gallery instead. Gallery pictures can be inserted into a post using the "Gallery" button in the editor (and uploaded using the "Gallery" menu item on the top right of the page).

Attachments are great for pictures that really only make sense in the context of one particular post. Note, gallery pictures are limited to 50 per account.

Larger image collections are best hosted on third-party sites, the downside being that when the account is closed or the photo album moved, all the links in the forum pointing there will become dead. Still, this would be the appropriate thing for things like large collections of pictures from some event.

If there's a picture without which a discussion becomes meaningless, by all means attach it or store it in the gallery (and please do not delete pictures some months later for no reason).
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby morrisammo » Tue May 03, 2016 1:54 pm

I so appreciate the Pictures,, yes they are worth 1000 words, as I'm a visual kind of guy and can work from a picture very well.

John Bartlett of Bartlett Sails, e mailed me,,, the sails I had,,, key word :shock: ,, had, are not reparable.

D&D marine to the rescue! I have 3 or 4 orders in with them,,, I know they should be able to pay the light bill this month! :lol: :lol: your welcome!
I am very happy that parts and sails, exist and that I can buy them.

this next week I'll make a lift cradle rig and get the boat off the trailer,, fix a few spots, fiberglass and bondo,, then sand it all down, and get ready to spray it.
I'll have to make a lil plastic wall to keep from over painting the house,,, but it will be fun!
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby GreenLake » Tue May 03, 2016 8:32 pm

Probably shouldn't use Bondo below the waterline. Perhaps better to use an epoxy-based fairing compound instead. Learn to mix your own, using the components from the WEST System, or purchase ready-mixed QuickFair from SystemThree, to give two examples. Both are a bit pricier than Bondo, but better when immersed.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby jeadstx » Wed May 04, 2016 2:07 am

For sails you might also want to check out Intensity Sails. http://www.intensitysails.com/gesaforda.html

I have a set of these and have been happy with them.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby morrisammo » Wed May 04, 2016 8:46 am

Good note on the bondo,,
I can glass over the spots too. they will hold.

I have worked a lot of fiberglass in the past,,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Il3SuHRgV8

old 8mm movies,, my Father's boat, built from his design. from my age of 11 to 17, I helped build it, I'm the kid wiht the hat, white tee shirt and jean cutoff shorts.
30 feet, 2500lb lead keel, aaaaaa the memories.

I already ordered the sails,,, that link,, had better prices,, oh well,,,,

and YES,, :mrgreen: parts have started to come in !!! very happy,,
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby itguy1010 » Wed May 04, 2016 11:22 am

jeadstx wrote:Greenlake, the jib sheet snagging issue occurs on boats with a hinged mast. I've had it happen in both light and heavy winds when tacking. The jib sheets snag on the hinge plate or more correctly on the pins securing the hinge plate. Older boats use a smaller hinge plate. When the hinge pins are replaced, they are often longer than needed to work with the newer wider plates causing the jib sheet to more easily snag. Also the height of the hinge has a bearing on often the sheets snag. I think that the lower the plate is, the less chance there would be of snagging. A lower plate might allow easier covering of the pins to prevent snags. I've tried several types of thing to cover the pins. Of course, a non-hinged mast should eliminate most snagging problems.
John


I had to replace my tabernacle pins because someone ( :oops: ) left them on top of the cuddy and drove home. I got the longer pins from Rudy and started having bad jib sheet snagging. My crazy solution was to buy one of those neoprene tummy belts that are sold as a fat burning gimmick. I trimmed the overall height of the belt so that it just covers the hinge assembly. It has a velcro strip on the end so I just wrap it around the hinge after raising the mast. No more snagging and it doesn't seem to interfere with any of my running rigging.


morrisammo wrote:John Bartlett of Bartlett Sails, e mailed me,,, the sails I had,,, key word :shock: ,, had, are not reparable.

D&D marine to the rescue! I have 3 or 4 orders in with them,,, I know they should be able to pay the light bill this month! :lol: :lol: your welcome!
I am very happy that parts and sails, exist and that I can buy them.

this next week I'll make a lift cradle rig and get the boat off the trailer,, fix a few spots, fiberglass and bondo,, then sand it all down, and get ready to spray it.
I'll have to make a lil plastic wall to keep from over painting the house,,, but it will be fun!


Sounds like you've got some work ahead of you. Honestly, I'd rather work on my boat than anything else that needs work around the house or yard. Of course, I'd rather be sailing than anything else, period.

Too bad about your sails. But... Don't throw them out. Perhaps a storm jib or trysail could be fashioned from them? Might be more trouble than its worth. Also, I have seen some YouTube vids that show people making totes out of used sail fabric. I'm looking for something like that for my anchor and rode so that it doesn't bang around in the cabin.
Eric White
The "Jackie Beck"
73 DSII #6428
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Re: New Guy! Just got a DS III

Postby GreenLake » Wed May 04, 2016 11:44 am

morrisammo wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Il3SuHRgV8

old 8mm movies,, my Father's boat, built from his design. from my age of 11 to 17, I helped build it, I'm the kid with the hat, white tee shirt and jean cutoff shorts.
30 feet, 2500lb lead keel, aaaaaa the memories.


nice video
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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