DS II Trailer setup

Moderator: GreenLake

DS II Trailer setup

Postby 109jb » Tue Aug 07, 2018 5:01 pm

Working on my daysailer II the last couple days and one of the things on my list is to replace the trailer bunks. Looking at how it is set up now it looks like the bunks have slightly deformed the hull. The deformation is not that great and I will likely just leave it and hope it pops out after relocating the bunks. I'm sure it probably affects performance, but since this is a leisure boat I'm not going to worry about it too much other than replacing the bunks and trying to prevent it from getting worse.

Right now the trailer has vertical bunks about 4' long about mid-length of the hull and just inside of the curve at the bottom of the hull. It also has 2 keel rollers, and 2 stern rollers. The stern rollers are the style that go side to side with one on either side of the hull and are about a foot forward of the stern. My plan is to replace the vertical bunks with flat bunks that are longer and wider but was wondering about location for them. Is there a place on the hull that is reinforced for bunks? Or is there an optimum/better location for them? Would like to see/hear what other have for their trailer setup.
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby GreenLake » Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:15 pm

For a DS1 you could have lined up with the seat edge, but for DSII I don't believe that there is a preferred spot. Wide and flat bunks behind the CB and rollers underneath the V part of the forward keel is what I use. My rollers are set up that the rear ones support the keel going forward but once the flat section of the hull hits the bunks, they take the weight. One roller sits underneath the CB.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby badgley » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:15 pm

I just did this last year on my DSII. Sounds like I had almost exactly the setup you are describing. Rollers along the keel and then only 2x4s on edge, probably not much more than 4' long, on each side. There was a lot of unsupported overhang at the stern and the aft ends of those boards caused some serious dimples. Plus, they were too close to the center, making matters worse. That poor boat flexed and wobbled everywhere when we hit a bump or I was standing on her. I was basically always just cringing and waiting for the loud crack...

The advice I got was just put as much surface area as you can under it. I ended up, if I remember correctly, using a 2x6x10' under the keel and a 2x8x8' on each side, set as far back on the trailer as I could. All of these placed flat to the hull, of course. I just put the side boards as far out as possible. There may be a stringer or two in there (Roger's book probably says) but I figured the turn of the bilge is going to be the strongest part either way so I just moved them outwards. I can tell you that the difference is night and day and there is no depression. It is super stable now. So my recommendation is just get as much contact area as you can based on your trailer and don't sweat the exact location.

The only downside to this setup is that unless you install guideposts, there is almost nothing to grab the boat laterally during recovery, especially if you submerge the trailer. I shamelessly stole the idea of someone else on here (maybe even GreenLake?) to keep one roller, under the keel as far back as I could mount it. The 10' long 2x6 then runs forward from this point on the trailer. Then if you back the trailer to where that roller is just at the water surface, you can use it to 'catch' and hold the bow and the forward part of the keel where it is still a sharp angle. Once you get to the CB and aft, the keel becomes so close to flat that it doesn't hold much anymore, but at that point the boat is sitting on the trailer and mostly out of the water so if you just keep pulling it always seems to come up straight. The local powerboat guys at the ramp look at you like you're crazy for basically hauling your entire boat out of the water by hand to recover it, but these boats are so light it's no big deal. It took a little practice and a couple of failed recoveries, but once you get the hang of it it works well.

Sorry, don't think I have a photo of my trailer empty, but I can try to snap some for you with it loaded to give you an idea if you have any parts you have specific questions about. Good news is that the hull dimples were only there under load and didn't leave any permanent depression, so now you'd never know they were there. Hopefully yours will be the same!
Brian Badgley
1982 DS II #10911 EGRETTA
Blacksburg, VA, USA
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby Zinger88 » Wed Aug 08, 2018 4:09 pm

Here is the link to a posting I did over in Repair and Improvement concerning the exact same topic https://forum.daysailer.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=5422#p30279. If I remember correctly I got the idea from badgley and thus far the setup has worked out perfectly with no issues. I really like have the weight sitting on the center bunk and the outboard bunks just providing the lateral stability while traveling. I don't have the center roller like Greenlake and badgley do to help guide the boat onto the trailer, however I typically winch the boat up about 5' at a time and then stop to check alignment. Been considering adding guide post but just haven't done it yet. :?

As for the oil canning of the hull caused by the previous 2x4 bunks on edge...it took about a week and the hull settled back into it's normal shape.
Jim H
'76 Daysailer II, Sail #7920, Windsong
Burton, TX
~~ _/) ~
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby badgley » Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:50 am

Zinger88 wrote:Here is the link to a posting I did over in Repair and Improvement concerning the exact same topic https://forum.daysailer.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=5422#p30279. If I remember correctly I got the idea from badgley and thus far the setup has worked out perfectly with no issues. I really like have the weight sitting on the center bunk and the outboard bunks just providing the lateral stability while traveling. I don't have the center roller like Greenlake and badgley do to help guide the boat onto the trailer, however I typically winch the boat up about 5' at a time and then stop to check alignment. Been considering adding guide post but just haven't done it yet. :?

As for the oil canning of the hull caused by the previous 2x4 bunks on edge...it took about a week and the hull settled back into it's normal shape.


Actually, I did mine in 2017 and remember looking at your post so I think I got the idea from you! But either way, yes those are excellent pictures and pretty much what mine looks like with the added roller. I see GreenLake's is slightly different, though, since it sounds like he has two rollers. So I may have stolen my roller setup from Tim Webb... can't remember who deserves credit.
Brian Badgley
1982 DS II #10911 EGRETTA
Blacksburg, VA, USA
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby 109jb » Fri Aug 10, 2018 2:00 pm

Thanks guys. Nice setups. I bought some materials and am going to tackle this over the weekend. What I plan to do right now is ditch the 2 aft rollers and place two 2x6x8' bunks on their side from the transom going forward. I have been a power boater all my life and it has always been bunks for me. I always ran the bunks all the way to the transom or even an inch or two past. I plan to do the same with the DS II, and keep the keel rollers. to start out, I will keep the bunks a little off the deformed area to see if it pops back. Since I will have bunk support on the transom and the keel rollers up from it should be stable and supported at strong points on the hull. I may put some guide bunks on later for loading, but will see how it goes.

Thanks again.

John Brannen
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby GreenLake » Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:53 pm

@badgley I think I have four rollers total; the rearmost one has a "notch" that captures the bow, so I retrieve with it just at the water level and it totally aligns the boat until the bunks lift it out of the water and then it can't float off sideways. Near perfect retrievals every time since I changed to that setup. (the roller sits 1" lower than then hull in the fully retrieved position, that is, the bunks take over the rear, past the CB).
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby 109jb » Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:53 pm

Thanks again guys. I got the trailer mods done today. I first made a crude crutch to go at the stern of the boat out of scrap 2x4's and then cranked the tongue jack up to the the boat off of the old bunks and the 2 stern rollers that I removed. Then I made up some 2x6x8' bunks and ran them from the transom forward, supporting them on 3 bunk brackets per side. The bunks are just inside the curve of the hull. Right now the weight of the boat is sitting on the last about 5 feet of the bunks with the forward 3 feet not quite touching. The bunks extend about 1 inch past the transom, so there is good support. There are 4 keel rollers, but once on the bunks the boat is resting only on the forward 2 keel rollers with the aft 2 acting as guides while hoisting the boat on the trailer. Looks good and I think it will work well. Also, the depressions that were in the hull from the old setup completely disappeared once the old bunks were removed. Near as I can tell the hull is straight and true now.
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby badgley » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:13 am

Nice work John, glad to hear the hull is still sound. Mine is the same way, not making contact for the full length. I figure if there isn't enough pressure to bend the wood, there isn't enough to damage the hull...

@GreenLake - I thought it was you who gave me the roller at the water surface advice. I must have just remembered the rest of your setup wrong. It works great for me also.
Brian Badgley
1982 DS II #10911 EGRETTA
Blacksburg, VA, USA
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby GreenLake » Mon Aug 13, 2018 5:13 pm

@badgley, I may have - I've had so many failed retrievals before I made that change that i "got religion" when it comes to starting with a roller like this:
Image

(found here: https://www.fisheriessupply.com/tie-down-engineering-poly-vinyl-keel-rollers-keel-roller).

The groove may be even deeper on mine; it does provide a nice "pivot" point once the first foot or so of keel is past the roller, pulling on the rope will straighten out the boat. Without a groove, there's a tendency for the keel to simply roll at an angle, rolling right off the roller.
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Re: DS II Trailer setup

Postby badgley » Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:05 am

Yep, exactly the same for me. I'm so thankful for that tip every time I recover!
Brian Badgley
1982 DS II #10911 EGRETTA
Blacksburg, VA, USA
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