DSII Bilge Leak & Cockpit Bailer - Advice/Mechanic Sough

[AndyKatonahNewYork]

My name is Andy, I'm a Vol. EMT/FF from Bedford, NY. My son and I, vacationing in NH for two weeks, just bought an '82 DSII that has some serious leaking problems I'm trying to get a handle on.

First, she is an '82, thus, presumably a DSII, right? We put her into the lake for the first time at a dock yesterday. Pumped the bilge dry (through the access ports), then left it overnight. The next morning ~10 hours later, the bilge was full to capacity. Now, I know that the centerboard housing seems to be on everybody's list of top suspects, but I can't find how to fix it, Mine appears to raise and lower via a rope. Do I understand correctly that it is likely some pivot hardware/fitting or something somewhere? I need better directions than that please (draw me a picture?) The questions I have are as follows:

1) Where EXACTLY is the leak coming from, please use plainest english to explain use of any fancy nautical terms.

2) I am a fair mechanic at best when equipped with my tools, which are conveniently now 250 miles away. Unless this is a total no brainer, I'd rather have somebody good the repair, preferably somebody who's done it before. I live in NY/CT area, but can trailer it down to NJ no problem when I get home, if she's not at the bottom of the lake by then. I am also all thumbs, know nothing of fiberglass, not very handly, and have little time to tinker with repairs now, or while at home (work like a dog). Could somebody please recommend a mechanic, preferably with experiencience repairing this same repair.

3) I am presently in New Hampshire, and will be travelling back through Massachusetts in two weeks if anybody knows a good mechanic along gthe way. However, since this is screwing up the family vacation, in the unlikely event anybody in mid-new hampshire, northern mass, east vermont areas felt like cruising over to winnepasaukee, they'd be well compensated for their time and fed like a king.

4) Secondly, and separately, there is a self-bailer plug at the back of the cockpit. The former owner of the boat just kept a cork in it. I would like to fix it properly. I found a plastic model at DR - Here's the link -- http://www.drmarine.com/proddetail.asp?prod=DS81 --. But I'm darned if I can see how the heck that looks anything like that metal drain that's there now? How does this thing install? Do you have to rip up the cockpit floor to get it installed under there? Same questions? Where can I find a good honest mechanic to do this work for me in NH, Mass, RI, CT, NY, NJ. Would very much appreciate all anybody coud do to help me here.

Signed - bailing hard in alton bay. (andy)

I would greatly app


As you said, when I got the boat (and presently) it has a pretty crusty looking metal fitting of some kind on the floor of the (cockpit?), you know, at the back of the boat, on the inside, against the transome. The seller told me that it is the automatic bailer, but that it does not work, and that he has always kept a cork in it (like in a bottle of wine) or otherwise the water would run in and fill the boat. Apparently, he never felt sufficiently moved to do something about it. I guess there must be some kind of broken one way valve down in there somewhere, and then it leads to the outside of the boat through one of those wholes on the exterior of the transcome (back of the boat) that has no exterior plug.

So I looked up "self bailer" for DSII on that DR Marine, and like you said, it shows something plastic that doesn'l look like that metal fitting. (not that I'd know what to do with one if it looked identical either) so now I'm confused two different ways.

Dumb Sailor Question of the Week Award: Were you able to figure out how to fix your self bailer? Did you do it with this item - http://www.drmarine.com/proddetail.asp?prod=DS81 - and here's the real kicker -- if so, how???????????

Any advice at all would be appreciated. I am not handy unless it is really a no brainer to fix, which would require explanation with few technical terms, etc. Even this maybe, ...... Question 1) is this the right part? Q 2) If I so, and I get the part it and bring it to a competent boat dude, should he be able to affect a repair with it, or (3) is there more to it than that?

Now, the bigger part is that the bilge is leaking like a sieve (nautical term), fills with water to the brim overnight. I know that everybody says the leak comes from the centerboard housing. I live in the NYC area, have the boat in New Hamshire now, and can bring it anywhere toward Lake George, into Connecticut or up to Rhode Island if you know a competent mechanic.

Well, that's all.

Your help would be much appreciated

andy heath

[adam aunins]

I'm no expert but this is what I would do.

1. pump the bilge dry.
2. load the boat onto a trailer.
3. inspect hull for any cracks that might let water in, around CB trunk
and bailer are good places to look
4. now this is where things could go wrong, use a garden hose to put
water back into the bilge wait and see if water starts to leak out.
Where it leaks out should be where it's coming in. The problem is
1. might not work
2. might put to much weight on the trailer / trailer might not
support the hull right with that much weight and damage the hull.

another/better way to find hull leaks is to take a shop-vac put the hose on the discharge side, then tape the hose into one of the bilge access ports (don't seal port up completely as you can damage the boat with to much PSI). Then while your hull has a small amount of +PSI take a spray bottle full of nice and soapy water and start squirting areas that you think water is getting into. If there's a leak you'll see air bubbles start to form up around it. (might be hard to check up in the CB trunk with the CB still in the boat)

Good thing about this is you're not under a boat that's got over a thousand pounds of water in it. I would go back and delete my first idea but it makes me laugh so I'll leave it there but DON'T TRY IT.

this is a good description of CB trunk leak problems (not all control lines are set up the same way, down hall is different on some.)
http://www.bobhunkins.com/mt-archives/DS2CBTLK_100.pdf


P.S. I would put the cork back in the bailer and leave it as the last thing to fix, unless that's where the waters getting into the bilge. You'll find that brand new bailers don't really do a great job of keeping the water out of the cockpit and a lot of the times you have to cut up the old metal bailers to get them out. (just my $.02 on the bailer)

[EberbachD]

While I continue to have some leakage issues as well (haven't tackled the center board yet), the amount of water coming in sounds like it may be the bilge plug assembly on the lower outside of the transom. It is possible that the assembly itself is leaking and probable that the o ring has cracked and is allowing water to pour in the back. It is also possible that the threads have failed, which happened on our 1980 DS II. Thought you should check the easy thing first.
Fair winds!

[owldraco]

I have actually tried filling the bilge with the garden hose. I let it fill for several minutes, before i had second thoughts. Still i did not see where ther was any leakage, and my boat has a number of cracks in the gelcoat. Next time i take her out, I'm going to see if she takes on water while a rest or in motion. I have also bee putting in more foam in the bilge, (in the form of pool noodled and styrofoam blocks) with the thought that there will be less room for the water.

andrew
central KY

[njsurfboat]

Ive had 2 ds 2s and one had a space between the hull and liner where the bailer goes through and the other was solid. If there is a void there apaprently the cork you are using from theinside isnt sealing the hull. Either try another vintage or buy the correct bailer fitting.

[Roger]

I'm not sure what to tell you without it sounding like I'm minimizing how you feel about getting somebody else to fix it. These are old boats, the people that own them have come to understand that they are a bit like Volkswagen Beetles. They are just not made like other cars (boats) so taking it to a marina will not likely help you. The diagram by Bob Hunkins is the best fix, if the uphaul hole is the culprit. These boats are notorious for bilge leaks but there are easily a half dozen or more spots that could be the source of the leak. I have written a book on the subject and indeed a whole section is dedicated to managing leaks. I'll try to be brief without missing any areas, but obviously cannot go into detail like I do in the book, on a fix for each. The most likely culprits for leaks, are the O ring in the bilge drain, the cb uphaul hole donut filler, the pivot bolt, the de Persia bailer, and finally the hull deck joint. Less likely, but still candidates are any seals on inspection ports, any hardware fittings, then finally cracks in the gelcoat.

e-mail me if you have other questions roger02 att mts dott net, but this is likely a fix you have to do yourself, and it may take weeks or months to get them all. These boats, (like Volkswagen's) are a work of love, and only other owners understand them well.

[hriehl1]

Given that he took on serious water in one night on the dock, and there was no mention of rain or heavy winds, it almost must be something below or near water line.

Given my exact same problems with my DS II (on Lake Winnipesaukee, no less), I'd agree (somewhat) with Roger's assessment.

I would dismiss the hull-deck joint since its way above water line, and no water would have touched it on one overnight at the dock.

And I am hard-pressed to believe it could be either the centerboard uphaul hole or the centerboard pivot bolt due to the substantial amount of water the boat took in during one overnight (presumably the lake was fairly calm on that overnight). They are both over water line and only take in what "sloshes"... my faulty uphaul hole only took in maybe 5 gallons of water on the very worst overnights.

I'd look first at the two items residing below waterline...
1. The bilge drain at the bottom-rear of the transom... either a missing o-ring or faulty (not properly bedded) female portion of the assembly , and
2. the bailer.

Good Luck

As an aside, Fay's Boatyard in Guilford (west shore of Winni about half-way up the lake) may be of some help. I don't know that they are specifically familiar with this DS II fix, but they are the most experienced with sailboats on the lake.